jamesjddongchess asked about 8...Qxd4. Please consult the move list where the moves are playable with the mouse (or the arrow prompts after the mouse clicks into a variation). The line given is  ( 8... Qxd4 9. Ngxf7 Nxf7 10. Nxf7 etc. I am noting also that 10...Kxf7 is not given due to 11.Bg6+ winning the queen.

Nd2 (the siegbert tarrasch idea ) is to let the c pawn free for play , but i prefer the Nc3 and i LOVE the Winamer ! <politicalmusic> in compensation for the "terrible" pawn structure , white has a 3 pawn in Kingside and completly demolished black pawns in this side, this side only with 7 Qg4 played (complicated game as i like :D)

gsorita, practice with both Nc3 and Nd2 could only be helpful. You might find what you are comfortable with. Often, a player's preference is a habit or follows fashion. Knowledge of the opponent's style is important. For example, a knew a player who always tried to play Ne5. One of opponents always used d6 against him. The comfort of the two players is a vital part of the game. It is not just a matter of what is "better" in a search for truth, but in a struggle.

hope i could differentiate also which is better in nc3 and nd2 maybe by adopting both lines in order to know the advantages and dis advantages of both lines

 jamesjddongchess wrote, "so did karpov prefer Nd2 or Nc3? which do you prefer?" Karpov was using 3.Nc3. I believe he switched to 3.Nd2 in 1973. However, he did play 2.Nc3 a little. I prefer to vary, not only using those alternatives, but also 3.exd5 and 3.e5.

very interesting stuff thanks!

Thank you for the posts....

In Tal's game,what a great move from John Nunn,17.Qd3..!

Dang.  Why didn't I think of that lol.  And I hate the winawer because of white's terrible pawn structure seems inevitable.  However, I've been sticking with Nc3 because I like playing the Alekhin-Chatard

 Politicalmusic, At least, in the French Defense, the two choices are covered under distinct lines shown in the books. 3.Nd2, the Tarrasch Variation, avoids the Winawer (3.Nc3 Bb4).

7. Ne5 should have been 7. Ne5N. Nunn wrote, "Technically an innovation, although the move is perfectly obvious."

Thanks.  I guess it makes sense (limiting what the opponent will transpose into or maintaining some flexibility.  I've wondered the same thing about the french defense. 

I usually play Nc3 in this variaion.

But I've seen Nd2 in a lot of games I've studies.  Since I don't totally understand it, I won't mimic it at this point.

 Politicalmusic, The difference between 3.Nc3 and 3.Nd2 is also subtle for players well above class B. In ECO (Encyclopaedia of Chess Openings, vol. B)  3.Nc3 is shown, so presumably what is different would have to found outside of the lines given under the Caro-Kann there. Suppose, Black plays g6 instead of dxe4 and the game becomes the Modern Defense. Then, White's knight would not be moving to e4 and White would have in advance chosen Nc3 or Nd2. On c3 the knight does not block the bishop on c1. On the other hand, on d2 it does not block the c-pawn. Of course, relocating the knight would be different in each case. It may be worth copying the preferences of players such as Karpov, but preferably with a little logic available to all.

A correction: J. Nunn - Ki. Georgiev, Linares 19998, 1-0, 42 was played in 1988.

Lonnie, can you explain to me why some people play 3. Nd2 instead of 3. Nc3?  Hey, I'm only a B class player so I don't know the positional subtleties :-).