DGT North American Clock Question

When I set the clock to a control with bonus time, say 3 minutes with 2 seconds increment, the beginning time on the clock is 3:02 instead of 3:00.  Is this normal?  It doesn't seem like it should be.  Is it an option somewhere?  I am being careful to set the start time to 3 minutes and 0 seconds and then the increment to 2 seconds.  It works normally after that, but there are 2 extra seconds at the start of the game.

This is a point I just dealt with this past Monday.

We were beginning a club night tournament over 4 evenings and we are using an increment for the first time.

When I set my Chronos and the Excalibur GameTime II it displayed the beginning time as 1:00:00, we are playing G/60, i/30.

I set my DGT 3000 and its display showed the beginning time as 1:00:30.

I had a DGT North American handy and to see the seconds had to set it under 20 minutes.  When I did it also showed the beginning display as the main time control plus the increment time.

So, I called my FIDE and DGT expert who is a FIDE arbiter that actually runs classes so others can qualify to be FIDE arbiters.  He also runs a club in the Chicago area and has DGT clocks that he provides for his tournaments, FIDE and USCF.  His name is Sevan Muradian.

Anyway, Sevan told me that this is a FIDE rule on the clock display, and the clocks are supposed to begin with the increment time added to the main control time per FIDE.

Now, we aren't running this as a FIDE event so I actually set my DGT 3000 at 59 minutes and 30 seconds with the 30 second increment.  The beginning display, set this way, shows 1:00:00.  Now it matches all the other clocks we are using in our event.

It is kind of noteworthy that the Bronstein method of delay, which adds the delay time after the button is pressed also begins with the delay time added to the main time.  The DGT NA has US Delay and not Bronstein.

Eyechess is correct.  Here's another thread where this is discussed.

http://www.chess.com/forum/view/chess-equipment/dgt-3000-chess-clock

Ah, so if I understand you correctly, this is by design and the workaround is just to set the initial time to time-inc?

Thank you for the responses.

Yes, that worked for me.

Of course if you are going to play by FIDE rules you would have the time added in the initial display.

The USCF rulebook doesn't really state a preference for this situation and one of the TD tips actually talks about the time being added before the move being equivalent to after.

Based on that, I think the ultimate decision would be up to the director.

Thanks, guys.  Always wondered this and just finally got around to asking.

This is correct.

The USCF rulebook does say that the Bronstein and US Delay are equivalent.

It really doesn't say anythiing about increment and the initial clock setting.

For FIDE events, the clock will show the total time of the main time plus the increment time.

For USCF events, the TD can do this any way he wants, from what I have read so far.

Adding 1 minute to a slow or standard time control game isn't much and neither is adding 20 seconds to the game time of a Quick game.  Understand that this is the 30 second increment for each side added up and the standard 10 seconds for Quick games for each side totalled.

I have a question to the other USCF TDs on the USCF forum.  A few of these guys are the ones that make and administer the USCF rules, so I am interested to see their take on it.

It's old topic but to be clear:

USCF (U.S. Chess Federation's Official Rules of Chess, Edited by Tim Just, 6th Edition) recommends to add incremental time to the initial time. It's the same as FIDE rule requires.

It is what the USCF rules says:

Page 14-15, rule 5F2. Standard timer for increment.

"a. ... A game with an increment time control should be set with increment in effect from move one, ..."

Page 241, rule 42E1. Recommended function of an increment clock.

"a. The display at all times should show the time available to complete a player's next move ..."

To complete a first move player has an allotted period of time plus incremental (added) time which has to be added even to first move.

And "3:02" (see initial topic) on a display which DGT NA (and another chess clocks with corresponding preset) sets as the beginning time on the clock is correct and follows the USCF rules and recommendations

I helped author the following "TD Tip" which has just been added to the online edition of the US Chess rulebook (https://new.uschess.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/12/US-Chess-Rule-Book-Online-Only-Edition-Chapters-1-2-11-5-11-20.pdf) and will appear in the print edition the next time it is updated. The TD Tip makes it clear that for increment time controls, the players get the increment for move one under US Chess rules and gives the recommended procedure for TD’s to use if a game is started without the increment applied for move one.

“TD TIP: Not all digital clocks correctly give the increment for move one when you set increment on the clock. For clocks that don't, the increment time in seconds should be added manually to the base time, if possible, so each player gets the increment for move one. For example, for G/3;inc2, each player gets 3.02 (three minutes and two seconds) to complete move one. If the clock only gives 3.00 for each player’s first move when the clock is set—with a base time of three minutes and increment of two seconds—then, if possible, two seconds should be added to each player’s base time when setting the clock. If a game is started without the increment applied for move one, it is recommended that the TD not allow the clock to be subsequently adjusted to add the increment for move one. This failure to adjust the clock initially should not be allowed as grounds to contest a later time forfeit claim.“