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Catalan for Black


  • 12 months ago · Quote · #1

    thehedgehog2000

    I have finished Avrukh's two volume series on 1.d4 and I found the Catalan section of it 99% perfect. There is one variation in the first chapter believe it or not, that is not covered and that seems to give black full equality as far as I can tell. Post your thoughts on the variation...Here it is:

  • 12 months ago · Quote · #2

    TameChess

    What would you do if 8)Qa4 weakening your Q-side (it weakens white's K-side too,but not much due to the reduction of pieces).

    8)Qa4

    Now what??

    It provides Black with double pawns

  • 12 months ago · Quote · #3

    thehedgehog2000

    8.Qa4 then Qd7 and after Qxc4 Nxd4 Bxb7 Rb8 Bg2 Bb4 and black has enough dynamic compensation for the bishop pair and the queenside weaknesses. If you take on c6 with the bishop instead of Qxc4, you lose your main asset in the position, the light squared bishop.

  • 12 months ago · Quote · #4

    MervynS

    Sticking this into the computer program I have, it seems to think that 9...Nxd4 is perfectly good for black too.

    Seems to me that most of the Catalan problems black faces is when Black decides to do the closed Catalan where dxc4 isn't played.

  • 12 months ago · Quote · #5

    TameChess

    TameChess wrote:

    What would you do if 8)Qa4 weakening your Q-side (it weakens white's K-side too,but not much due to the reduction of pieces).

    8)Qa4

    Now what??

    It provides Black with double pawns

    I meant 8)Qa4 Qd7

                 9)BxN

  • 12 months ago · Quote · #6

    thehedgehog2000

    yes I know after you take my knight, I take with the queen and after a trade of queens I am up a pawn and while you might win it back (they are tripled) The position remains equal as I can get counterplay with c5 and material is still balanced.

  • 12 months ago · Quote · #7

    pellik

    There are lots of lines in Avrukh's book that need updating. Don't listen too much to houdini about the e3 lines you've gotta let it think before it realizes that (8-12)...h5 isn't an easy draw.

  • 12 months ago · Quote · #8

    thehedgehog2000

    pellik wrote:
     

    There are lots of lines in Avrukh's book that need updating. Don't listen too much to houdini about the e3 lines you've gotta let it think before it realizes that (8-12)...h5 isn't an easy draw.

    yeah that's the line that I was thinking was good in this whole variation. Don't get me wrong though, as far as i can telll, the rest of the catalan section is excellent.

  • 12 months ago · Quote · #9

    New_Member24

    I recall that Avrukh's recommendation against the slav was refuted a year or two after the book was published. It is definitely possible that a line or two in the book may be incorrect to some degree.

    The other possibility is that Avrukh recommends the line despite an equal evaluation by a computer. White does have the bishop pair and a central majority, so there at least is something to play for despite the position being objectively equal.

  • 12 months ago · Quote · #12

    ghostofmaroczy

    thehedgehog2000 wrote:

    yes I know after you take my knight, I take with the queen and after a trade of queens I am up a pawn and while you might win it back (they are tripled) The position remains equal as I can get counterplay with c5 and material is still balanced.


    @thehedgehog2000, black's tripled c-pawns are terrible.  Also, the absence of queens benefits White.  I would take the White side of that position.

  • 12 months ago · Quote · #13

    thehedgehog2000

    ghostofmaroczy wrote:
    thehedgehog2000 wrote:

    yes I know after you take my knight, I take with the queen and after a trade of queens I am up a pawn and while you might win it back (they are tripled) The position remains equal as I can get counterplay with c5 and material is still balanced.

     


    @thehedgehog2000, black's tripled c-pawns are terrible.  Also, the absence of queens benefits White.  I would take the White side of that position.

    black can always play c5 getting rid of his tripled pawns.

  • 12 months ago · Quote · #14

    ghostofmaroczy

    thehedgehog2000 wrote:
    ghostofmaroczy wrote:
    thehedgehog2000 wrote:

    yes I know after you take my knight, I take with the queen and after a trade of queens I am up a pawn and while you might win it back (they are tripled) The position remains equal as I can get counterplay with c5 and material is still balanced.

     


    @thehedgehog2000, black's tripled c-pawns are terrible.  Also, the absence of queens benefits White.  I would take the White side of that position.

    black can always play c5 getting rid of his tripled pawns.

    When you get rid of tripled pawns you still have doubled pawns.


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