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Having difficulties finding 1...e5 openings in databases?


  • 23 months ago · Quote · #1

    chessteenager

    Its so easy to study 1.e4 just go to chessgames.com and look at all of bobby fischers games as white or maybe tal or grischuk or Anand. Its so easy to study the caro kann just look up Karpov and bam you got all the variations. Oh you need the French just look up Korochnoi!

    But studying 1..e5 is hard. Every single player who plays against 1...e5 in GM play only plays against the Ruy lopez all day. No other opening shows up for modern masters. Carlsen has over a 1000 games with 1...e5 but only 9 games playing against the Italian? The only way to find italian games or scotch is if i go back to morphy and anderssen but thats not where i want to learn opening theory i want it from modern day? I even purchased the Kaufman Rep but his repertorie is too....shallow? Where can i find grandmaster games with people playing the Italian or the scotch or ponziani against 1...e5. 

     

    Im just trying to learn 1...e5 and its a lot harder then when i tried learning the french or caro kann. 

  • 23 months ago · Quote · #2

    chessteenager

    Btw the reason i am moving to 1...e5 is because i missed an important part of my chess education in the open games. This is true right? 

  • 23 months ago · Quote · #3

    blasterdragon

    i suggest you study some of paul morphys game there are alot of e4-e5 games since it was the attacking era of chess heres one i like

  • 23 months ago · Quote · #4

    Expertise87

    Grandmasters very rarely play against the Ponziani. Look in any database of 2500+ games and you will find plenty of Italians and Scotches though. I don't know why you would limit yourself to Carlsen's games and assume that all modern masters never face the Italian.

  • 23 months ago · Quote · #5

    Quasimorphy

    You can search for specific openings in the games collections that people have assembled at chessgames.com.

    http://www.chessgames.com/perl/collections

  • 23 months ago · Quote · #6

    shepi13

    The Kaufman repetouire is definately not too shallow for a 1500 player.

    Granted, their are quite a few lines where I don't quite agree with his assessment (he claims Nc3?! is a dubious gambit in the giuocco piano, and gives the best move as Bd2 for example). Nevertheless, his lines are sound, and while a GM might be able to punish the few small inaccuracies in his analysis, against anyone at your level his openings should give you at least an advantage.

  • 23 months ago · Quote · #7

    shepi13

  • 23 months ago · Quote · #8

    shepi13

    blasterdragon wrote:

    i suggest you study some of paul morphys game there are alot of e4-e5 games since it was the attacking era of chess heres one i like

     

    That game is more shallow than any modern book in terms of opening theory. Yes, it was a great attack, but Bg4? is a miserable move that already puts black in a hopeless position, so there is very little theory it can contribute. 

  • 23 months ago · Quote · #9

    Oraoradeki

    Don't know about Italian game, but I know Kasparov played the scotch as an alternative to Ruj Lopez. Maybe you can look into his games...

  • 23 months ago · Quote · #10

    Expertise87

    shepi13 - 18.Rh3 is not a computer move, (well maybe it is but the move predates modern strong computers) and after 18.Rb3 Black is still better. Kaufman and most analysts agree that White simply doesn't have enough for the pawn, not to mention there is a stronger continuation available than 9...Bf6 where Black is clearly better out of the opening.

  • 23 months ago · Quote · #11

    TitanCG

    Why not look at IM games and up?

  • 23 months ago · Quote · #12

    Dutchday

    You can find plenty of games, if you just narrow the search down.

    You don't absolutely need the most modern games. That being said, Nakumara does play the Scotch sometimes. What more could you want?

    The Italian and the Ponziani may not be that popular, but you can still look  up those openings specifically. It is most important you see the e4+c3+d4 plan. This also happens in the Ruy. In fact, quiet lines in the Ruy can barely be distinguished from the Italian at all. 

    Remember a line is not validated because a GM played it. It is if good moves were made.

  • 23 months ago · Quote · #13

    ponz111

    chessteenager If you wish to learn about the Ponziani you might consider joining our vote chess group Ponziani Power.

    We have much informations in our forums.

    We have vote chess games where every move is discussed by several players.  You can also learn a lot about the Ponziani and chess in general if you wish to watch or participate in vote chess.

    We sometimes have Ponziani theme tournaments.

    We also invite you to ask questions.  There is no "stupid" question and we would be happy to answer your questions.

    Players who have joined our group are usually very surprised at the amount of learning/information they receive.  They are also surprised at the vitality of the Ponziani Opening.

    Dave Taylor/ponz111

  • 23 months ago · Quote · #14

    Grumblesmurf

    Look for players who play in a lot of open tournaments, not super-gm's who mostly play in closed events. For example, Glenn Flear and Mark Hebden both play e5 consistently against mixed opposition, so you'll find a lot more variety in their black games than in Carlsen's.

  • 23 months ago · Quote · #15

    Mandy711

    @chessteenager When searching in chessgames.com, type ECO codes instead of player's name. Open games 1.e4 e5 are from C20 to C59. 

  • 23 months ago · Quote · #16

    chessteenager

    Thank you everyone!!

  • 23 months ago · Quote · #17

    jbird39

    chessteenager, here is a suggestion. Go to Chessgames.com. You will find

    over 8000 Giuoco Piano games(C50-C54) and over 4700 Scotch games (C45).

    All are master and non-master games from 17th century to 2013.

    Hope this helps.

  • 23 months ago · Quote · #18

    blasterdragon

    shepi13 wrote:
    blasterdragon wrote:

    i suggest you study some of paul morphys game there are alot of e4-e5 games since it was the attacking era of chess heres one i like

     

    That game is more shallow than any modern book in terms of opening theory. Yes, it was a great attack, but Bg4? is a miserable move that already puts black in a hopeless position, so there is very little theory it can contribute. 

    fischer commented that it was a weak move

  • 23 months ago · Quote · #19

    blake78613

    The Italian game is played by Tiviakov, other GMs that occasionally play it are Bologan, Movesian, Gelfand, and Kramnik.   Short plays a variety of e4 opening including the King's gambit.

  • 21 months ago · Quote · #20

    royalbishop

    Grumblesmurf wrote:

    Look for players who play in a lot of open tournaments, not super-gm's who mostly play in closed events. For example, Glenn Flear and Mark Hebden both play e5 consistently against mixed opposition, so you'll find a lot more variety in their black games than in Carlsen's.

    Thanks


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