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Najdorf Poisoned Pawn Move after Qb6?

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Kernicterus

I tried to look through old articles but that was a mess - and was going to provide more information than I want to chew right now. 

Can I get some of my fellow players to tell me what the idea is behind the Poisoned Pawn variation, and more important...how does White handle this oddity and why so many odd options for White?  - continuation please? 

I am seeing that after 7...Qb6, there are a few options. 

8. Qd2  (looks scary)

8. Qd3  (still looks scary)

8. Nb3 (the one my simple chess logic wants to go with)

8. a3 (huh??)

Amanultra

a3 is a trap. after Qxb2 Na4! surprise! i like a3. Qd2 is solid and gains the open b file for the rook on a1. The Najdorf in general is scary. I play either of these two lines.

Atos

If you want to go into the Poisoned Pawn, then Qd2. (I am not sure if there is a good way of avoiding it once you reached this juncture but Nb3 and a3 are playable.) After Qxb2, the possibilities are Rb1 or Nb3, hoping to trap the Black Queen although it is far from easy. For something further you'll need the Opening Explorer.

Amanultra

the point is that you should be willing to give up your b pawn to keep blacks queen out of the game for some time. Fischer even got his queen trapped by spassky in 72. it was one of their match games in rejkavic

Atos
Amanultra wrote:

a3 is a trap. after Qxb2 Na4! surprise! i like a3. 


Yes but if Nc6 the White will have to play Nb3 anyway, so a3 might prove to have been a loss of tempo. (Although it does give the Black a nice opportunity to blunder.)

Kernicterus

Oh boy, this sounds like fun.  Bunches of it.

Shakaali

8. Qd2 (if I remember correctly, this is an idea of Paul Keres) Qxb2 is the absolute main line of the poisoned pawn and leads to some of the most heavily analyzed positions in the whole opening theory of chess. Not so long ago there seemed to be agreement among GMs that both 9. Nb3 and 9. Rb1 have been analyzed down to a draw and consequently 6. Bg5 was very rare in top level chess. However, recently there has been remarkable revival, but I don't know what exactly has changed. Anyway, 9. Rb1 seems to be the most popular nowadays when white oviously has compensation in the form of development advantage and also because it will not be so easy for black to finnish his development.

I think following your simple chess logic with 8. Nb3 can't be too bad if you want to avoid the most heavily analyzed lines. In general 6. Bg5 is extremely theory heavy line even inside the generally very theoretical Najdorf variation.

Atos

If you want to avoid Poisoned Pawn it's probably best to play 6. Bc4 or 6. Be2 instead of 6. Bg5.

mateologist

my analysis (bxf6)! black "must " take the pawn either way his kingside pawn-structure is damaged. (Qxb2) Now white plays (Nb3) two points : the bishop at (f6) protects the (Nc3) the (Nb3) protects the (Rook). black must regain his piece so(Pxf6). now whites (Qd2) protects the (Nc3) . the black queen is blocked in and out of play (for awhile) the black king will not find a safe haven when he castles on either side of the board! please correct me if i am wrong! black must pay for i believe this "prematue" attack! 

DR_84-92

i agree with amanultra a3 gives you a temporary diversion with a nice pawn structure.

electricpawn
Atos wrote:

If you want to avoid Poisoned Pawn it's probably best to play 6. Bc4 or 6. Be2 instead of 6. Bg5.


...also the English Attack.

KingOfChess999

I like a Sicilian Najdorf cause its a popular game, but like above position is strong concepts but if want give one pawn then Qd2 is a good move or Qd3 to protect center strong position or if you don't want pawn loss then b2-b3 or Ra1-b1, don't scary to move, and one more thing you have accurate move, its just chess play friend. Good luck!

Thank you very much!

:)

By: KingOfChess999

WhiteKnight56
Amanultra wrote:

a3 is a trap. after Qxb2 Na4! surprise! i like a3. Qd2 is solid and gains the open b file for the rook on a1. The Najdorf in general is scary. I play either of these two lines.


Ouch.  8. a3 Qxb2, 9. Na4 Qb4+, 10. c3 Qa3, 11. Nc2 does seem to win the black queen.  I think sharp lines like that are why I gave up the Najdorf for the Dragon many years ago.  :) 

erikido23
WhiteKnight56 wrote:
Amanultra wrote:

a3 is a trap. after Qxb2 Na4! surprise! i like a3. Qd2 is solid and gains the open b file for the rook on a1. The Najdorf in general is scary. I play either of these two lines.


Ouch.  8. a3 Qxb2, 9. Na4 Qb4+, 10. c3 Qa3, 11. Nc2 does seem to win the black queen.  I think sharp lines like that are why I gave up the Najdorf for the Dragon many years ago.  :) 


 someone gave up the najdorf for the dragon because of sharp lines? 

Amanultra
WhiteKnight56 wrote: Amanultra wrote: a3 is a trap. after Qxb2 Na4! surprise! i like a3. Qd2 is solid and gains the open b file for the rook on a1. The Najdorf in general is scary. I play either of these two lines. Ouch.  8. a3 Qxb2, 9. Na4 Qb4+, 10. c3 Qa3, 11. Nc2 does seem to win the black queen. Sorry but the queen cannot even check on b4 without being captured.
clubplayerone

8.Qd2 is a forced draw. That's why 6.Bg5 have lost interest at topel level chess

mateologist

i play the najdorf why should i take the pawn? for the pawn what do i get! (not  much)! it is not a center pawn,i am already behind in developement, and after white plays (Bxf6) my kingside pawn structure is ruined and my only developed piece the "queen" which may be under "stress" (white can keep his pawn). just my opinion!

PrawnEatsPrawn
That's what I'm talking about!
Kernicterus
Atos wrote:

If you want to avoid Poisoned Pawn it's probably best to play 6. Bc4 or 6. Be2 instead of 6. Bg5.


I don't want to avoid it - yet.  I'm first trying to learn about it.  Thematic tournament. 

Amanultra wrote:

a3 is a trap. after Qxb2 Na4! surprise! i like a3. Qd2 is solid and gains the open b file for the rook on a1.


Oooh, nice. 

Shakaali...that's informative. 

mateologist.  I have no idea what your entire post is saying. 

Kernicterus

Estragon...that's a strong sentiment.  You don't like the other options besides 8 Qd2? I definitely have no desire to study the line thoroughly as you and LaskerFan have suggested is necessary...I'm just playing a themed tournament and was hoping to see why White allows for the theft of his b pawn with the database's offered moves...or how it is recovered.  Or why it's poisoned...

LaskerFan...I appreciate the staunch and thorough response. 

So, in essence...8. a3 keeps the b pawn and isn't too bad a move for White?