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12th December 2008, 10:48pm
#1
by DW_Batty
WI United States
Member Since: Dec 2008
Member Points: 217

Anyone here ever like to try and hold onto that extra pawn in a queen's gambit accepted? I know black gets a worse position, but does have an extra pawn. Think there might be any usefulness to such an opening, a possible example of which is given here?

12th December 2008, 11:00pm
#2
by GeneralMiller
United States
Member Since: Aug 2008
Member Points: 182

The queens gambit is a very tough combination opening to master, but once mastered, it is tough to be defeated.

12th December 2008, 11:07pm
#3
by Youngdude
Iowa City United States
Member Since: Jul 2007
Member Points: 158

Why not 6. Nf3?

12th December 2008, 11:39pm
#4
by Phelon
International
Member Since: Oct 2008
Member Points: 2297

Your example is  pretty bad continuation no offense. e4>e3 imo and I would certaintly never put my queen on f3.

13th December 2008, 08:50am
#5
by DW_Batty
WI United States
Member Since: Dec 2008
Member Points: 217
Phelan wrote:

Your example is  pretty bad continuation no offense. e4>e3 imo and I would certaintly never put my queen on f3.


No problem. The idea behind e3 and Qf3 is after axb5 preventing cxb5 as Qxa8. Qa5 on blacks part is then pinning white's a pawn to the rood.  e4, not playing for this trap, is met differently by black. I was just showing my idea to meet this trap, shown in a few opening books as why black should not try to hold on to the pawn in a QGA.

13th December 2008, 09:01am
#6
by broze
Bath England
Member Since: Nov 2007
Member Points: 844

No white is definitely better after Bd2 and Rc1, black REALLY shouldn't try to hang on to that pawn.

13th December 2008, 09:04am
#7
by sstteevveenn
Wales United Kingdom
Member Since: Dec 2007
Member Points: 1648

hmm can white play 5.Nxb5?  It certainly looks like it. 

 

hmm apparently he can but it doesnt get him anywhere good.

13th December 2008, 09:09am
#8
by NM Reb
United States
Member Since: Sep 2007
Member Points: 7857

In the QGA whites 3 Nc3 isnt the best move , there are 3 that score better in fact : e4,e3 and Nf3 all do better than 3 Nc3....however, Nc3 also scores better than 50% for white.

13th December 2008, 09:47am
#9
by dpakoh
Sofia Bulgaria
Member Since: Dec 2007
Member Points: 57

after 5th black move white is better for sure. i also ran it with chess engine and it gave + 0.62 which is pretty much won game if played properly. so look for another variation mate!

best.

13th December 2008, 05:39pm
#10
by Elubas
United States
Member Since: Aug 2008
Member Points: 7816

No, black can't hold onto the pawn and if he tries to, white can get it back with a big edge, but it can be tricky for beginners and even early intermediate players. Don't take it with the idea that you have an extra pawn. The real idea of the QGA is for black to improve his position before white gains the pawn back.

13th December 2008, 06:42pm
#11
by pvmike
Voorhees, NJ United States
Member Since: Feb 2008
Member Points: 1063

there are lines in the semi-slav and slav where black can hold onto the pawn, and not be at a disadvantage, but black can't force white to play those lines.

16th December 2008, 07:16am
#12
by AnthonyCG
Washington DC United States
Member Since: Aug 2007
Member Points: 6628

White can take the pawn back by force "no matter what." This will leave Black with an awkward position. There is a gambit line with 1.d4 d5 2.c4 dxc4 3.e4 when White can give up the pawn and play like a real gambit.

16th December 2008, 09:56am
#13
by DW_Batty
WI United States
Member Since: Dec 2008
Member Points: 217
SkyChess wrote:

I personally prefer 3. e3. Now if he tried to hold on to the pawn, he loses even more material. A possible continuation is 3. ...b5 4. a4 c6 5. axb5 cxb5 6. Qf3, and there is no way to save the rook unless to move 6. ...Nc6 or 6. ...Bb7. If 4. ...Bd7 then 5. axb5 Bxb5 6. Nc3 Ba6 7. Qf3 c6 8. Rxa6! Nxa6 9. Qxc6+ Qd2 10. Qxa8+ Qd8 11. Qc6+ Qd7 12. Qxa6 and white is up two minor pieces! lol, I spent that much of my time thinking of that, I have no life :)


In your second line, black would play 6...c6 to try and hold onto the pawn. However, the consensus seems to be that black cannot do this, so I guess it doesn't matter. Thank you all for commenting, though. I figured it probably wouldn't be best, but wanted to know what everyone else thought.

16th December 2008, 10:09am
#14
by Loomis
Durham, NC United States
Member Since: Oct 2007
Member Points: 4945

Black can cling to the pawn and if white plays it like a gambit, get games like this:

 

13th February 2009, 01:03pm
#15
by keir
kent United Kingdom
Member Since: Nov 2008
Member Points: 1

Anyone tried 3. ...Be6? Cannot find any literature about it. What am I missing?

13th February 2009, 06:36pm
#16
by Loomis
Durham, NC United States
Member Since: Oct 2007
Member Points: 4945

3. ... Be6 is anti-positional. It blocks the e-pawn, making development of the rest of the pieces slower. It has been tried by strong players, but in the hands of mere mortals it doesn't tend to turn out well:

http://blog.chess.com/Loomis/amateur-adventures-with-1-d4-part-ii

 

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