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Queen's Gambit


  • 2 years ago · Quote · #1

    checkmateisnear

    The main line goes as follows 

    Any suggestion? 
    So far this is what I (the computer) came up with (with quite a bit of sidelines)so far

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #2

    Fiveofswords

    no. this is not going to work for you and its quite typical of computer inspired openings. I think 11. Bd6 is an extremely unlikely move. the one other line you looked at, qc7, that line goes absurdly deep, seriously, with very few of the moves actually being forced (same is true with the bd6 line, indeed especially that one, because black has shed a piece, he can be as creative as he wants heh). i think you have reasonable chance of reaching the position at move 11, but then the game may go all sorts of directions. IN my opinion, this central advance looks pretty strained, and i dont trust it. I would at least castle first. Even then,its hard to tell if the handing pawns are good for you or not, blacks pieces certainly dont seem to be poorly placed and i think he could blockade your center and make it weak, very likely.I dont know if you are familiar with more common minority attack ideas, but this would seem like a nice option. (b4-b5 plan) in this position there are too many possible moves, you cant just know all of them, what you need are good working plans and thematic ideas.

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #3

    checkmateisnear

    Castleing first runs into 

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #4

    AnthonyCG

    Ideas are much more important than move orders in the queen's gambit since both sides have so many plans available. This isn't the kind of opening you want to learn by rote. Your results will be very bad.

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #5

    Fiveofswords

    black trades some pieces, sure, white cant get everything in the QGD, this is why its considered a solid opening for black. Better to allow some exchanged imo (and like i said, blacks pices are not very badly placed) than to create some pretty clear weaknesses for black to jump onto.

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #6

    checkmateisnear

    I know the ideas fairly well (minority attack and advance in the center and sometimes Ne5 followed by f4)
    The problem with the h6 line is that it's hard to prevent the exchange of dark-squared bishops and if the bishops are exchanged e3 becomes too weak after f3 leaving White with only the minority attack which also isn't as effective as in the line where the knight is on f3 because the knight is more active there. Also it blocks the retreat square of the bishop if Black ever plays c5-c4, forcing it to go to f5 where it will likely be traded as well.

    So the only other option is 0-0-0 with a kingside attack but those lines don't promise much either (along with the fact that it's not so much in tune with my style of play.).

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #7

    checkmateisnear

    Fiveofswords wrote:

    black trades some pieces, sure, white cant get everything in the QGD, this is why its considered a solid opening for black. Better to allow some exchanged imo (and like i said, blacks pices are not very badly placed) than to create some pretty clear weaknesses for black to jump onto.


    The problem isn't so much that Black trades pieces, it's that by doing so it prevents one very important plan for white after which whitee doesn't have much of a chance for an advantage.
    Now I'm considering a move order like 

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #8

    Fiveofswords

    after black frees his game by forcing some exchanges (a normal qgd thing), i dont think he has quite equalized yet. White has the c file, black the e file. White can create pressure on the c file by advancing the b pawn, while it is much harder for black to advance his f pawn. There are other ideas also, but this is the really critical one, imo.

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #9

    Fiveofswords

    sorry i posted my last before i saw your replies. This h3 idea you had looks more interesting. But idk, there must be some stuff know about this, how have any games gone so far? im not a 1d4 player nor do i usually play the qgd, i only know the very basics, but have good general positional feel. h3 looks interesting, black still cant quite manage to push his f pawn, i dont think.

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #10

    Fiveofswords

    maybe you could play your idea with ne2 and f3, but then NOT play e4 for quite some time, instead bring bishop to f2, castle. that could be interesting. I think you need to be ok with playing very sharp that way however, maybe even 0-0-0 in some sitruations.

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #11

    checkmateisnear

    In the main line White doesn't push until everything is prepared ron e1 or d1 h3 a3 and b4 to prevent c5 sometimes and Kh1 I don't think it'll work with Ne2 though since the inclusion of h3 weakens the dark squares quite a bit.

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #12

    Fiveofswords

    of black plays in a way which prevents f3 then you dont have to play it. there are other interesting ideas here. I like the idea of going for Ng3-f5 in the position you showed

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #13

    checkmateisnear

    My other consideration would be "main line"

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #14

    checkmateisnear

    Fiveofswords wrote:

    of black plays in a way which prevents f3 then you dont have to play it. there are other interesting ideas here. I like the idea of going for Ng3-f5 in the position you showed


    White has many ideas, but somehow I think Black is somewhat better in this variation in the main line. My only question would be "why isn't this the main line??" 

    Also Ng3-f5 usually ends up in Bxf5 when Black's main problem is gone and though white probably has a small edge, black has a comfortable game with counter-play on the e-file; after all the knight can still possibly come to e4 after Qe7.

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #15

    Fiveofswords

    well a variety of plans is nice, and you can look for moves which can be useful in as many of them as possible, and let black chose for you what direction to go. If i were you i wouldnt look at hard analysis really, I would play some games and develop a feel for them. Its really not rare that there are moves in classical openings which appear to be better, but are less commonly played. In fact they may actually be better, but I would nto trust computer judgement in a very manouvering sort of position like this.like i said, i dont much trust f3 idea anyway, it just seems too commital and weakening. how to claim much advantage against qgd? seems very hard, its simply a clear and solid opening. You can be happy that less solid stuff is more popular. Theres a couple of things in my own repitoire where I am aware that black can play a certain way and really not sure if I have advantage at all, not even a small one. I dont think its a big deal...as long as you understand the position you can just play it.

    this opening is not sharp, and its not much that is fixed for either color. I would not worry much about analyzing it, just be familiar with ideas. save hard analysis for sharper, concrete openings.

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #16

    checkmateisnear

    f3 with the plan of e4 is a very important idea! The problem is that after h6 if Nh4 then 0-0 Black has the move Ne4 which just gives Black enough counter-play to equalize.


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