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Sicilian minus a move as black against the English


  • 3 years ago · Quote · #1

    electricpawn

    I like to play the white side of an opening as black and vice versa. The goal is to play openings with you are familiar with. In this game, my oponent played the English. I played e5, Nf6 and d5; a Sicilian set up minus a move. Please provide any feedback you find appropriate.

  • 3 years ago · Quote · #2

    electricpawn

  • 3 years ago · Quote · #3

    electricpawn

    Nb6, Nc6 with the intention of castling queenside may be a better plan, and I think 9.exd4 was a mistake for white. I was looking at 6...Nc6 7.Nf3 e4 8. Ng1 f5, or something along those lines with a king side attack.

    Your observation about the strong pawn center for white is a good one.

  • 3 years ago · Quote · #4

    kvlc

    White's opening looks bad.  Why voluntarily hang those pawns?  Black gets such a comfortable position without having to do anything to earn it.  Then after putting all his pawns on dark squares, he gives away his light square bishop without issue?  Is white trying to lose?

  • 3 years ago · Quote · #5

    kvlc

    uhohspaghettio wrote:
    kvlc wrote:

    White's opening looks bad.  Why voluntarily hang those pawns?  Black gets such a comfortable position without having to do anything to earn it.  Then after putting all his pawns on dark squares, he gives away his light square bishop without issue?  Is white trying to lose?


    What game is this in? White didn't "voluntarily" hang any pawns, he lost one pawn by a mistake that was not obvious.

    Another other pawn was left hanging also after this, but black didn't take it.


    I mean the c and d pawns are in a "hanging" position.

  • 3 years ago · Quote · #6

    blake78613

    I think playing a reverse open Sicilian as Black is pretty risky.  Playing a reverse closed Sicilian or reverse 3.Bb5 (Bb4 as Black)Sicilian works out all right as the extra tempo doesn't mean as much.

  • 3 years ago · Quote · #7

    Silfir

    I think what he was referring to is this:

    That's a "hanging pawns" formation for black: It's two pawns in adjacent files facing no oppositions in front of them, but on the files on the outside.

    For the record, this formation has both advantages and disadvantages, much like an IQP: If mobile, it can force the creation of a passed pawn, which is a dynamic advantage, but statically, they make easy targets.

    The game depicted above did not contain a hanging pawns formation; it requires the two pawns to be in adjacent files that are open to the opponent, but to not be passed pawns. The c-pawn, however, is not in an open file. I get that formation frequently on the black side of the Sicilian and I've never felt it is particularly weak; though in the endgame the splinteredness might become an issue.

  • 3 years ago · Quote · #8

    kvlc

    uhohspaghettio wrote:
    kvlc wrote:

    I mean the c and d pawns are in a "hanging" position.


    Well I'm going to have to correct you for two reasons:

    1) Hanging means there is nothing protecting the a piece from being captured whatsoever. A piece hanging is the exact same as a piece en prise. 

    2) That is an absolutely IDEAL pawn formation for white. I haven't the slightest clue at all where you're getting the idea that those pawns aren't good like that. The whole point I was making was that Nxc6 (Nxc3 here) is known to usually be bad in the Sicilian because it gives Black (white here) an amazing pawn structure and pawn centre. It also opens up his dark-squared bishop and his b-file for his rook.

    So I do not know how you can possibly call two powerful and ideal centre pawns when the opponent has no centre pawns at all bad or "hanging".


    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pawn_structure#The_Queen.27s_Gambit_-_Hanging_Pawns

    The pawn structure at move 9 is certainly not ideal for white.

  • 3 years ago · Quote · #9

    kwaloffer

    Bankwell wrote:
    LOL.

    "Well I'm going to HAVE to correct you..."

    Smooth one, Finn MacCool.

    Apparently you've achieved your lofty rating and superior knowledge of chess without ever consulting a single book on the middle game.

    Curious.

    Doesn't Rybka have a feature that tells you what pawn formations are called?


    Way to evacuate the moral high ground seconds after seizing it...

  • 3 years ago · Quote · #10

    electricpawn

    blake78613 wrote:

    I think playing a reverse open Sicilian as Black is pretty risky.  Playing a reverse closed Sicilian or reverse 3.Bb5 (Bb4 as Black)Sicilian works out all right as the extra tempo doesn't mean as much.


    You have a good point, and this variation is frequently used. Spaghettio is right about the pawn center regardless of the terminology used.

  • 3 years ago · Quote · #11

    I_am_Johnny_Chess

    I'd rather play a black system with the white pieces.. So it's like I'm up a move in an opening I know well.

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