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Sicilian Najdorf 6. f3?

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27th October 2009, 12:39pm
#1
by king_warrior
Krusevac Serbia
Member Since: Feb 2009
Member Points: 612

Several times when Sicilian Najdorf were played against me, i felt helpless. So, I was researching a litle bit to find the most aggresive countinuing after ...5.a6. And I have found Ouachita's game against Rybka. But it seeams that something were wrong: White played 6.f3 isn't this a quite bad move, and in my surprise machine answered ...6 e5. Such a strong softver didn't play Qb6! and advantage for black, or at least equal game. And such a player to play 6.f3. I know for Be3 and than f3. I would like Ouachita to answer this, but it is like his profil can't be find on the site. Am I wrong about these two moves?

27th October 2009, 12:40pm
#2
by king_warrior
Krusevac Serbia
Member Since: Feb 2009
Member Points: 612

What was that ? I ment f3 not a6

27th October 2009, 01:35pm
#3
by Archerknight
Leeds England
Member Since: Mar 2009
Member Points: 540

It's an agressive opening. It can be played.

27th October 2009, 01:46pm
#4
by king_warrior
Krusevac Serbia
Member Since: Feb 2009
Member Points: 612
Harry_Li wrote:

It's an agressive opening. It can be played.


 Why, if Qb6 gives advantage for black?

27th October 2009, 02:16pm
#5
by SukerPuncher333
Canada
Member Since: Nov 2008
Member Points: 677

It's a pretty common move I thought. In the typical English defense (6. Be3), black sometimes responds with 6...Ng4, which is annoying for some white players. 6. f3 transposes into the English while avoiding Ng4.

I doubt 6...Qb6 gives advantage to black. Which opening database shows that? I checked two databases and both show higher winning percentage for white. Does an engine show advantage for black after Qb6?

27th October 2009, 02:27pm
#6
by -waller-
Durham/Worcs England
Member Since: Apr 2009
Member Points: 1507

BTW, you can't find Ouachita's profile because he was banned.

27th October 2009, 02:44pm
#7
by king_warrior
Krusevac Serbia
Member Since: Feb 2009
Member Points: 612
SukerPuncher333 wrote:

It's a pretty common move I thought. In the typical English defense (6. Be3), black sometimes responds with 6...Ng4, which is annoying for some white players. 6. f3 transposes into the English while avoiding Ng4.

I doubt 6...Qb6 gives advantage to black. Which opening database shows that? I checked two databases and both show higher winning percentage for white. Does an engine show advantage for black after Qb6?


 In enciklopedia of chess openings I couldn't find 6.f3, and in a  chess program Chessmaster chalenge master edicion which has over 700000 GM games, there is no a single game with 6. f3. But there is about 500 games with 6. Be3 and than f3. I thought that is becouse ...6 Qb6. And it is quite obvious becouse after ...6.Qb6 white is hard to castle and develope...

27th October 2009, 02:52pm
#8
by king_warrior
Krusevac Serbia
Member Since: Feb 2009
Member Points: 612

And how white should continue, to keep after ...6.Qb6 advantage, some line please. And why Ouachita is baned? Cheating???

27th October 2009, 03:11pm
#9
by Archerknight
Leeds England
Member Since: Mar 2009
Member Points: 540

Qb6 can be followed by Bc4 as the b pawn can no longer move.

27th October 2009, 03:22pm
#10
by eaglex
Seoul South Korea
Member Since: Mar 2009
Member Points: 521
its just engllish attack Be3 with f3 first most likely to avoid ng4 lines
27th October 2009, 06:18pm
#11
by SukerPuncher333
Canada
Member Since: Nov 2008
Member Points: 677
king_warrior wrote:

 In enciklopedia of chess openings I couldn't find 6.f3, and in a  chess program Chessmaster chalenge master edicion which has over 700000 GM games, there is no a single game with 6. f3. But there is about 500 games with 6. Be3 and than f3. I thought that is becouse ...6 Qb6. And it is quite obvious becouse after ...6.Qb6 white is hard to castle and develope...


Wow, that's surprising that they don't have a single game with this line. This really isn't that uncommon. For example this database shows 114 games containing 6. f3, where at least one of the players were 2700+ rated, and only counting games after 1991. For comparison, there are 429 games with the 6. Be3 line with the same search conditions (one player >2700, games after 1991).

27th October 2009, 06:20pm
#12
by Ringwraith2021
United States
Member Since: Mar 2009
Member Points: 562

wow, ouachita got taken down like all the others

28th October 2009, 01:31am
#13
by king_warrior
Krusevac Serbia
Member Since: Feb 2009
Member Points: 612

OK, it is that so, than i am probably wrong. But i wouldnt mind at all to be played against me 6.f3...However, I'll keep playing 6. Be3 and than f3.

28th October 2009, 02:48am
#14
by hicetnunc
Neuilly-sur-Seine France
Member Since: Aug 2007
Member Points: 5378

6.f3 aims at transposing into an English attack set-up (6.Be3; 7.f3) while avoiding the disruptive 6...Ng4

6.f3 Qb6!? is the only independant try for black. I don't know if it's better or worse than the regular main lines, but it's certainly playable and has been endorsed by very strong GMs

Rybka probably picked 6.f3 e5 as one of the valid answers in her opening book.

28th October 2009, 02:54am
#15
by NM Reb
United States
Member Since: Sep 2007
Member Points: 7857

After  6 f3 Qb6 7 g4 my database has white scoring 64% in 22 games with Anand, Leko, Grischuk, Ponomariov, Svidler and Kasimdzhanov all playing the white side !  I would say thats a very strong recommendation myself.

28th October 2009, 06:11am
#16
by hicetnunc
Neuilly-sur-Seine France
Member Since: Aug 2007
Member Points: 5378

But hasn't 6...Qb6 been played by the likes of Polgar and Grishuk among others ? Smile

28th October 2009, 06:30am
#17
by NM Reb
United States
Member Since: Sep 2007
Member Points: 7857
hicetnunc wrote:

But hasn't 6...Qb6 been played by the likes of Polgar and Grishuk among others ?


 Yes, and a game by Kasparov as black as well, he drew , after 7 g4   White is doing well after  7 g4  according to my database.

30th October 2009, 10:59am
#18
by king_warrior
Krusevac Serbia
Member Since: Feb 2009
Member Points: 612

Hm...I it seems that I was wrong. But that this forums use for.After Qb6 white with g4 castles on Qween's side.

30th October 2009, 11:20am
#19
by WanderingWinder
United States
Member Since: Jul 2008
Member Points: 1109
king_warrior wrote:

Hm...I it seems that I was wrong. But that this forums use for.After Qb6 white with g4 castles on Qween's side.


...which is white's plan with the English attack anyway...

10th February 2012, 08:46am
#20
by NoobWook
Chicago United States
Member Since: Mar 2011
Member Points: 93

i got a game going like this right now, little worried since im playing black

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