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The Waite-Harrison Attack


  • 2 years ago · Quote · #1

    The_Gavinator

    Hello! This is an Opening that my friend and I had developed. The defining move is 3.Bf4 as seen in below. It is like a reversed Italian Game.
     
    We have had a similar thread, but that got trolled out. I made a new thread to discuss this opening in complete seriousness. After 3. Bf4, the two main moves disscussed were Bf5 and c5. Here are both lines, which favor white.
     

     

    Please only post if you have meaningful, and intelligent information to say. Don't comment that this is bad just because it is unusual, or because it look's like a patzer's opening. (After 3...Nc6 4 Nb5 wins material, threatining the fork). I don't mind this being criticized, I in fact enjoy it because it helps build the lines, but please do so in a professional manner.

    EDIT: Against, 3...c5, I believe 4. b4 is busted. For that line, I now recommend 4. e3.

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #2

    jetfighter13

    in your first variation, Qa5 and Black is fine in the position, and can safely castle

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #3

    jetfighter13

    and in your second line, Qa6 is just horid, looses tempo, and is completely unforced, better is 0-0-0 castling behind a sturdy shelter and preparing e5!

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #4

    jetfighter13

    also I admit, cool name for the opening

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #5

    bresando

    Surely posting in a less provocative manner ("winning attack" at move 4, come on ;)) would reduce the amount of trolling.

    Anyway, leaving aside that there are several good alternatives for black at move 3, in line 1 what about simply 5...Na6 (threatening 6...e5)?

    EDIT: In fact 5...e5! is much stronger, white is dead at the end of that line you give as "obviously dominating"! 8...Nc6! (who cares about the attack on c7?) 9.Nc7+ (from now on everything is forced) Qxc7 10.Bxc7 c2+ 11.Qxb4 Nxb4 and white is 2 pawns down for absolutely nothing.

     



    Line 2 is very unconvincing. I don't see white's "powerful central control" in the subvariation after 10.Ne2, i see a centre which is melting after a quick c5. In the mainline i'm not sure about Qa6, but even after that white's king position is rather worrying.

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #6

    NachtWulf

    Line 1: 8. ...Nc6 9. Nc7+ Ke2, then what does white do?

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #7

    jetfighter13


    here I will consolidate your lines into one diagram, and offer variations

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #8

    jetfighter13

    Natch, you mean Na6, plus my Qa5 line is a faster way to equality, and it has a nasty little trap

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #9

    NachtWulf

    jetfighter13 wrote:

    Natch, you mean Na6, plus my Qa5 line is a faster way to equality, and it has a nasty little trap

    Nope. White is in trouble, since black has a devastating pawn push, albeit an exposed king.

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #10

    NachtWulf

    bresando, can black do even better? Suppose black doesn't sacrifice the queen, and instead offers to move the king. Black can win even more!

    Edit: Ah, the king movement doesn't work, since 9.Nc7+ Ke7 10.O-O-O Nxe5 11. Qxb4+. I didn't notice that the recapture came into check when I first tried out the combination, but a two pawn advantage is already enough to be considered "winning".

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #11

    bresando

    No, he means 8...Nc6 (but 9...Qxc7! is the right follow up; i don't see a reason to allow white to complicate matters with 9...Ke7?! when 9...Qc7 is a neat win) see my previous post. it's much stronger than 8...Qa5. In fact it leaves white in a lost position.

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #12

    jetfighter13

    yeah, but if he continues with the plan, then he gets Mated

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #13

    jetfighter13

    after e3 it is hard to stop Nxa2 gaining a second queen, even if for a limited time

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #14

    The_Gavinator

    Why not just play 3 Bf4 c5 4 e3. White's development dominates.

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #15

    AnthonyCG

    What does 4.b4 do? Isn't that just a free pawn?

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #16

    The_Gavinator

    umm those moves aren't playable...

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #17

    chessmaster102

    i don't get b4 but what you posted is already known as the tarzan attack (no trolling real name)

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #18

    jetfighter13

     


    remember give concrete variations as to why The_Gavinator, because that is why the other thread turned out the way it did, you guys labled half of the counters "crap" and ignored them, all without giving reasons why. anyway I think that after these moves in my Qa5 variation white has a hard time

     

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #19

    The_Gavinator

    jetfighter first of all, your board doesn't appear. Second of all, paul posted an illegal move, it is literally not playable...

  • 2 years ago · Quote · #20

    jetfighter13

    that should be fixed by now, um also I just understood what he ment, as exd4


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