I discovered some time ago that political "point by point" discussions never could persuade people. People need to come to something of their own volition and won't be persuaded against their will.
Yea, wouldn't want facts and logic to get in the way.
I discovered some time ago that political "point by point" discussions never could persuade people. People need to come to something of their own volition and won't be persuaded against their will.
I discovered the same thing:) But, I also know how it feels to me when I read propaganda: I want someone to reject it. So, on the very few subjects I have been able to keep up with, I feel that I should say something for others(maybe in this case, Iranians who don't speak english as comfortably as a native speaker).
Facts? Whose facts?
Sisu,
I can remember when Iran did start a war. If you read back a couple of posts, I did say the Persians attacked Greece on several occasions. The Persians lost most of the wars.
Jihad means struggle. It's original meaning was a struggle within oneself against alcohol, infidelity, and other self-destructive behaviors.
Now it is a term used to mean "holy war", usually against infidels or non-Muslims.
“Today’s world is full of thieves and plunderers of human honor, dignity and morality who are equipped with knowledge, wealth and power, and under the pretense of humanity easily commit crimes and betray human ideals and start wars in different parts of the world.”
You forgot to add the next paragraph.
In response to a question by a parliamentarian on how long this battle will continue, Khamenei said,”Battle and jihad are endless because evil and its front continue to exist. … This battle will only end when the society can get rid of the oppressors’ front with America at the head of it, which has expanded its claws on human mind, body and thought. … This requires a difficult and lengthy struggle and need for great strides.”
Which makes it clear that Iranian leaders are really concerned about lofty ideals, but want make war with the United States and not afraid of using the ideas of jihad (that apparently means using suicide bombers and terrorists).
I think you are trying to lie to me.
"I'ven had my say and sticking by it." That's the attitude of fundamentalists and other closed-minded people. They are often unwilling (but not unable) to change their minds when new facts and ideas appear. It is also a major cause of war, esp. religious wars.
That is why I was asking for facts here. But all you seem to care about it is complaining how the US, and really no one else unless it has connections to the US, has harmed you. That Russia and the USSR didn't have designs on your country (or didn't you know that?), or that Iran does a pretty good job harming itself. Or that many terrorists have connections to Iran. Or that Iran has caused wars of its own making (see above).
It's the broken record routine.
It's plastic, ever-repeating, can't put anything new on it, and hoping that someone out there might believe in your rhetoric if you repeat it over and over and over again.
By the way, the major news sources do not get their news from the state department.
If they did, they would not have to send correspondents to different countries and put them in harm's way. The news corporations were also the ones that uncovered the Pentagon lies in Viet Nam, Watergate, the Arms for Hostages deal (with Iran!) during the Reagan years, Monica Lewinsky relationship with Clinton; all to the State Department chagrin.
If the new organizations did get all their information from the State Department, how did they get these news stories? Some of them, by the way, earned then Pulitzer prizes for journalism.
But old records can never listen, only speak (or shout depending how high the volume might be), and will eventually wear out.
I discovered some time ago that political "point by point" discussions never could persuade people. People need to come to something of their own volition and won't be persuaded against their will.
I discovered the same thing:) But, I also know how it feels to me when I read propaganda: I want someone to reject it. So, on the very few subjects I have been able to keep up with, I feel that I should say something for others(maybe in this case, Iranians who don't speak english as comfortably as a native speaker).
Yes, of course. My post followed your's but wasn't specifically aimed at you and I generally agree with you 
I discovered some time ago that political "point by point" discussions never could persuade people. People need to come to something of their own volition and won't be persuaded against their will.
But that doesn't stop them from being fun to write out.
I discovered some time ago that political "point by point" discussions never could persuade people. People need to come to something of their own volition and won't be persuaded against their will.
But that doesn't stop them from being fun to write out.
What do you mean by "fun" and what do you mean by "write" ? (
)
Barefoot_Player seems to be spending a lot of time and energy promoting obviously biased views with half truths and outright lies. perhaps he's is being paid by the hour?? i referenced the "liberal" media because we are constantly told that our media is liberal when in fact it is centrist at best, reliably patriotic, and blindly apologetic for the Pentagon and State Department when anything substantial is at stake. this trend has only grown more deplorable in the past few decades. no wonder there are so few if any truly independent investigative journalist working here anymore as they all must go overseas in order to tell the kind of truths that are no longer allowed to be spoken here for fear of indefinte detention without due process. paid internet shills like Bf_P are all too common these days, even on sites like chess.com. even if he's not being paid he clearly is keeping at least one eye tighly shut in order to avoid facts contrary to his entrenched jingoistic philosophy and broken record talking points. i'm not going to bother to address his ridiculousness point by point because that will only encourage him and further entrench his limited dogmatic views. i've got pieces to move. peace~*
I've had my say and I'm sticking by it. Like trysts says, the western media is very clever at twisting words.
That blanket statement, while probably true to some degree, is completely unfair. All media is skewed and more so in nations where the govenment controls or has direct influence either over media, or over which media the citizens are exposed to. The US doesn't control the media nor does it limit its citizens' access. Every nation, whether it's the US, Iran, Switzerland or Britain justifies its actions and tells it's own history. It's up to the individuals to decide what to accept and what to ignore. Western nations have access to every POV, so to simply say Western media skews the truth implies other nations don't, which in itself is the doing what you accuse.
The man with no shoes wrote, "I can remember when Iran did start a war. If you read back a couple of posts, I did say the Persians attacked Greece on several occasions. The Persians lost most of the wars."
Man! you're old! Able to remember the Persian Empire and all. I wonder though, how did an empire that controlled nearly half of the human population lose "most of the wars?"
The U.S.A. government does control the media both directly and indirectly. The latest exposed example is the New York Times being told to shutthefuckup about the N.S.A. in 2004.
@batgirl, you are correct in part but naive overall since half a dozen (or less) corporations control the vast majority of US media that the vast majority of US people are exposed to and accept as "the truth". those few corporations decide what news is fit to print and broadcast and unsurprisingly they defer to "official sources" unquestioningly in order to maintain access to those sources of pure propaganda. those who enjoy wealth, power, and influence under the current status quo create, promote, and maintain many public myths in order to further their private ends. the internet has become an exception, but the establishment has been attacking independent internet media vicously and tells us that only "conspiracy theorists" believe anything that isn't from the MSM and annointed as true by some USG "official", especially regarding foreign policy and the economy.
I've had my say and I'm sticking by it. Like trysts says, the western media is very clever at twisting words.
That blanket statement, while probably true to some degree, is completely unfair. All media is skewed and more so in nations where the govenment controls or has direct influence either over media, or over which media the citizens are exposed to. The US doesn't control the media nor does it limit its citizens' access. Every nation, whether it's the US, Iran, Switzerland or Britain justifies its actions and tells it's own history. It's up to the individuals to decide what to accept and what to ignore. Western nations have access to every POV, so to simply say Western media skews the truth implies other nations don't, which in itself is the doing what you accuse.
Sorry batgirl...as much as I respect your opinion on many things...I have to sadly disagree with you...They don't have access to all POV, just the ones that sustains and nourishes the ideology of the U.S. The manipulation is extremely subtle and carried out by very intelligent people, that is why it is hard to see.
LOL just on a crazy footnote the CIA was collecting DNA in Pakistan under the cover of Polio vaccination wtf!!!
This thread gives free rein to any and all Urban Legends, and Conspiracy Theories.
What have you people been smoking ??
What have YOU been smoking?
Do you have any tobacco?
Professor; I think you missed the point of that article. We're still gonna spy, we're just gonna change the cover story. And I smoke way too many Marlboro.
I discovered some time ago that political "point by point" discussions never could persuade people. People need to come to something of their own volition and won't be persuaded against their will.