I was offered a draw in this position and I accepted. Could white (me) have won with accurate play?

I would have been reluctant to take the draw hoping to make something out of my a & b pawns, but I think I would have taken it too. Would have been exhausting to grind out a promotion. I'd say don't be unhappy with it. What was your opponent's rating compared to yours?

I don't know if it's really possible to give a definitive answer here. Certainly the opposite colour bishops make it more drawish than it would otherwise be, and my feeling is that with perfect play Black ought to draw, but all that can be said with complete certainty, I think, is that White has chances to win and is in no danger of losing. There's no reason not to play on, but that doesn't mean that you'll win in the end. It's just a fight.

In practice, these things can go either way. Shipov-Cherniaev, Biel 2007, for example, reached the same material balance and structure as you have here (though with Black's pawn already on a5, which may be significant), and Shipov eventually won. Averbakh-Flohr, USSR Championship 1950, on the other hand, was very similar to your position, but was drawn.

I think you could win even with "not accurate play" lol. You can improve your position easily (Rc7 just now). Black king is a bit ugly there (you can put pressure against f7 with ur two pieces). It's definitively a win. If u like whe can "play it" and I'll show u how to win.

It is Black to move, so presumably he's not going to just meekly allow White to play Rc7. He might go ...Re7, or perhaps ...Bf8 or ...Kf8 to meet Rc7 with ...Re7 (I'm assuming that the pure bishop ending is drawn).

lithium11 wrote:

I would have been reluctant to take the draw hoping to make something out of my a & b pawns, but I think I would have taken it too. Would have been exhausting to grind out a promotion. I'd say don't be unhappy with it. What was your opponent's rating compared to yours?

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My opponent was rated 1825 at the time of the game.

hehe i agreed to a draw in a much worse position:)

Its annoying, but i said yes before i could think about it.

Back to your schedule, a draw wasnt the worst thing to do , but if u were confident in your endgame skills,maybe next time its time to game on:)

dude u are a weenie u should have kept playing

Personally, I would have played on confident in my pawn advantage, especially since his king could play no part in defending on the left.  But I can say that because I don't know how tiring the rest of the game was for you.  If you mentally struggled just to keep up to get to that point, it might be a good reason to draw.

According to Fruit, with accurate play from both sides, after 20 moves you wouldn't stand better than your starting position.

Nevertheless, I suggest you to ALWAYS play quite equal endgames, since mastering them is fundamental for any serious player.

Me? I think I would have gone on......reason? still a tie....but anything can happen. Also look at this,who is stronger in the end game you? or him?

<Camembert> but all that can be said with complete certainty, I think, is that White has chances to win and is in no danger of losing.

Camembert! I know what you mean, which is, white has chances to win and ( in theory, obviously assuming white doesn't play very poorly or blunder outright) is in no danger of losing.

But for me, there's no better way to lose a won game than to say to myself "with complete certainty I'm in no danger of losing" --  At the class-player level (my level and Davie's too I believe) blundering away an endgame pawn advantage into a loss is absolutely commonplace. Jeremy Silman has said it very well, "There is no position so won that it plays itself" 

 I've lost won games way too many times -- it makes me sick and I always swear never again -- and it always starts with "he's got nothing, I'm good to go." When I think I'm winning I have to bear down and tell myself, "Sit on your hands, find the best moves, find the fastest win, DON'T take your boot off his throat for one moment!" 

 

That said, absolutely this is a very premature draw. Positions like this look to many players as though they are boring or predictable -- maybe if it's karpov vs capablanca they both see it perfectly but for mortals this is the set up for an excellent dramatic difficult endgame where White certainly has winning chances and no guarantees. You should have kept playing davie. 

I'd love to give you an example of a beautiful swindle where I had a completely losing endgame and I managed to turn it into a draw because my opponent relaxed and got overconfident... but unfortunately, when I saw that my swindle actually looked like it was going to work, I got overconfident and gave the win right back. ( it's all true ).

Here's my favorite endgame study of all time -- It comes from "Imagination in chess" 

Opposite color bishops... "The kingside pawns are blocked, and there's no possibility of creating a passed pawn on the opposite wing. Does this mean it's a dead draw?"

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

*Ahhh I've just found a wonderful game that illustrates my point earlier about never say.. "I can't lose!" I'm going to put it in a separate post. It's soooo similar to the game Davie is playing!

Please note the material and positional similarity to Davie85's game! I think this might be my new favorite endgame study of all time!

Shameless Ping... come on check out those endgames I posted, they're awesome.

Hi Dave,

This is exactly the type of position that you should play out. Black can go wrong many ways. Imagine how happy you would be to have your draw offer accepted if the shoe was on the other foot.