sweet tactical shot in ruy lopez

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3rd July 2009, 02:19pm
#1
by shuttlechess92
California United States
Member Since: Jul 2008
Member Points: 1911

       here, knights > bishops. Comments welcome!

3rd July 2009, 02:22pm
#2
by klhn444
Houston, Texas United States
Member Since: Jul 2008
Member Points: 2763

cool thanks!

3rd July 2009, 03:03pm
#3
by sstteevveenn
Wales United Kingdom
Member Since: Dec 2007
Member Points: 1634

"15...d5 16.Qxd5 loses less quickly."  Looks like black wins...

3rd July 2009, 03:15pm
#4
by shuttlechess92
California United States
Member Since: Jul 2008
Member Points: 1911
sstteevveenn wrote:

"15...d5 16.Qxd5 loses less quickly."  Looks like black wins...


 

please explain.  White can swing a rook to attack the king after Re1, etc. remember the Bc8 is undeveloped, so coordination with the rooks is difficult.  I still believe that white has a winning position.

3rd July 2009, 03:23pm
#5
by sstteevveenn
Wales United Kingdom
Member Since: Dec 2007
Member Points: 1634

It's too slow.  Black is up a piece.  The bishop can probably even be developed with tempo against the white queen, connecting the rooks at the same time.  White is down a piece and has no checkmate.  Qxc2, or Qf4 both look fine for black.

3rd July 2009, 03:40pm
#6
by shuttlechess92
California United States
Member Since: Jul 2008
Member Points: 1911

15. ...Qc2??  16. Rc2!  and black can not stop the rook from swinging to g3 without losing his queen.

Qf4 is unclear.

3rd July 2009, 04:05pm
#7
by sstteevveenn
Wales United Kingdom
Member Since: Dec 2007
Member Points: 1634

no, 16...Qxc2 or Qf4.  Qxc2 being the better of the two. 

3rd July 2009, 04:08pm
#8
by BFM
Tallinn Estonia
Member Since: Nov 2007
Member Points: 310

15..Qd7 with a plan to stop mate threat with Qg4 or play Qf5 attacking both queen and bishop, if White makes a slower move - looks winning for Black.

I do not see any way for White to justify this tactical shot after that.

 

15.d5 still loses, but not because of Qxd5 - that would be a mistake. After d5, White still has a possibility to keep the mate threat up by playing 15..Qd2, targeting g5.

3rd July 2009, 04:21pm
#9
by shuttlechess92
California United States
Member Since: Jul 2008
Member Points: 1911
sstteevveenn wrote:

no, 16...Qxc2 or Qf4.  Qxc2 being the better of the two. 


     thus Qc2 instantly loses.

   I guess after 15...Qd7 I will try 16. Re1, but I have not analyzed this thoroughly. thanks for the comment though.

3rd July 2009, 04:25pm
#10
by BFM
Tallinn Estonia
Member Since: Nov 2007
Member Points: 310

18.. Qxf6

3rd July 2009, 04:33pm
#11
by immortalgamer
Oregon United States
Member Since: Sep 2008
Member Points: 1342

I'm sorry, but I must disagree with you here shuttle.  White doesn't win here in the final position you show.  I would just take the bishop.  Then when rook checks I block with queen.  Yes Black loses queen, but look at the material loss it has taken to win her.

Perhaps white can force draw, but it is not a won position by any means.

3rd July 2009, 04:42pm
#12
by BFM
Tallinn Estonia
Member Since: Nov 2007
Member Points: 310

Why bother blocking with a queen if you can play Kh8?

3rd July 2009, 04:42pm
#13
by sstteevveenn
Wales United Kingdom
Member Since: Dec 2007
Member Points: 1634

Yeah, white doesn't win.  The bishop is hanging and with that gone black's king is given room to move. 

3rd July 2009, 04:55pm
#14
by shuttlechess92
California United States
Member Since: Jul 2008
Member Points: 1911

I didn't see that the king could move to h8.

 

geez don't get all mad at me! I"m just a human =(  I"m not as good as a computer.

3rd July 2009, 05:20pm
#15
by Whis
United States
Member Since: Feb 2009
Member Points: 72

King can't go to h8 in the diag above, just play h6 the Rg3+ Kh7

3rd July 2009, 05:55pm
#16
by immortalgamer
Oregon United States
Member Since: Sep 2008
Member Points: 1342
BFM wrote:

Why bother blocking with a queen if you can play Kh8?


True.  I guess I was just making a point...but Kh8 is winning for black...NicE

 

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