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I had a queen and my king, he had a rook and his king... i could not figure it out nor do i know if it is possible or not. Please explain if you know a way to do this all's he kept doing was dancing his king around the rook, and if i tried to move my king in he would just check me with his rook...
This is possible, but generally not trivial. Even masters have struggled in the past to win this within 50 moves against perfect defence (by an engine using tablebases). Most endgame books contain samples.
It is possible, but not easy.
Time to get a copy of Keres' "Practical Chess Endings" and start studying- all knowledge in there is essential.
Little by little, using both queen and king, you had to push him to one of the borders. Once there, your oponnent either would be forced to give away his rook or get mated, however, one has still to be carful, since there are still some tricks that can force stalemate...
It can be a victory hard to achieve in rapid games but, with some time and technic, it´s a win alright.
Yes it was in a blitz game so i couldnt figure it out in a 1:20, thanks for all your response's
this is VERY easy to do if you watch it ONCE...read the book elway
I had a correspondence game like that once and resigned. It is not easy over the board however.
The thing is that this ending is very rare. I have had it only once in thousands of games. So, it may not be practical to learn this ending when there is so much more to learn. Just learn the general principals of how to win.
Not easy to do at all against best defense. The concept is easy but the actual moves are pretty tricky if the defender knows what to do. Time OTB is critical with this one and number of moves. 1 or 2 slips and it can be a draw.
Idea is drive king to the edge of the board, then at some point zugzwang forces the king and rook to separate then the queen tries to for them
FYI look at the kramnik-Toma game today for an example although his was with a pawn the concepts are the same
I'm discovering that learning certain endgames teaches you ideas that you can apply outside of those endgames, so this and other uncommon endgames are probably worth studying in my opinion. I have a USCF CC game where I won a queen for N+R and we each have four pawns on the board. It seems like ending up in this endgame is not extremely unlikely. I'm fairly confident that I'll be able to execute it even though I never have before. I know it's not easy, but I literally have days to spend on each move. Even though endgames like this are rare, it's nice to be confident in your ability to win them because then you have the option of going into it and win.
no boys I'm joking with gokuelway...but I know him well and he'd see it once and be good to go...it's certainly not easy by any means.
Oxford Companion To Chess claims that Queen versus Rook ending should take no more than 31 moves with perfect play.
It's the "perfect play" part that gets you.
let's put it this way, if I am online and in a situation where I have a rook and the other person has a queen - if the other person mates me within 50 moves, there's 100% no doubt in my mind that he or she cheated.
There have been 2 times when I've seen this OTB. The one time I saw the one with the queen win, both were 1400 players and the adult swindled the 8 year old kid out of his rook at around midnight and the kid was about to fall asleep. The other time I saw this, an FM was playing an Expert and they agreed to a draw after about 25 moves of going around in circles.
I'm sure any non patzer that actually has studied the endgame could do it. Masters have messed up the BN endgame too, but you wouldn't claim that someone's cheating if they beat you with that one.
I am just about 100% certain that I could beat anything/anyone in a Q+K vs. R+K endgame playing at CC time controls. I bet I could beat you with the queen in standard tournament time controls.
It's just completely stupid to assume cheating because someone plays well. Now if they played 31/31 of the tablebase moves in a 31 move endgame, this would be extremely suspicious.
It's a long process, but the technique is pretty simple.
Assuming Black is the weaker side, he must keep his Rook close to his King, else the Queen will be able to maneuver to check and win it. So White brings his King as close as he can to the Black pieces, and uses the Queen to pin the Rook when possible, limiting Black's choices.
Once the Black King is driven to the edge, he runs out of room to meet the mating threats, and will either get mated or lose the Rook.
try to fork king and rook
I had it a couple of times against human players, and it was pretty easy. I took 43 moves against a computer though.
Even if it's hard vs. 'perfect defense', 'perfect defense' is also hard to achieve, and I wouldn't expect it from someone around or under my level to have let me reach a theoretically winning position.
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