Do you think it is impossible to achieve a master title for some people? I hear this all the time. People say chess is only for smart people. Bobby fischer by american standards was stupid for devoting his life to chess and not finishing his education. So, I will raise the question again. Are some people not intelligent enough for chess?

I have an opinion on the matter. I believe it takes time and dedication. It is a skill that is learned right? Some people might make master class faster than others, but still People can make it if they try hard enough.

I wish to hear your opinions. So, you should feel free to post.

Thankyou, Thomas

Given unlimited time and resources to dedicate to the task, I believe that some still simply don't possess the capacity to accomplish it.

 I think the number of people who could never be a chess master is very small and likely hinges on their endurance rather than their intelligence.

 However, Chess takes time and a lot of people don't get involved in Chess until they're much older and miss out on prime learning time. If you're 30+ years old and don't know anything about Chess but decided to take it up as a hobby one day then you would have a much rougher journey ahead of you if you decided you wanted to become a master.

I'm with grobe. Not everyone has the same mental capacity/discipline. But I think the majority of chess players can make master, it's just really hard for most people and most end up giving up before they accomplish it.

However, if one does not try their hardest his work will reflect the effort. While one can not be gauranteed success by trying, He can work toward success by learning what is required to succeed. again time and effort are required. Easy come easy go, eh?

I was trying to be nice about it, but I agree.  An excess abundance. 

Your answers are great, but what if time and dedication were not the issues? I don't think every master has had an IQ above ninety. You can't judge someones intelligence, when determining if they can make master. I do agree that you can judge their determination, when deciding if they will make master.

That's true lol

I don't know about that! I think there comes a point when one's intelligence is too low to have any real chance of making master no matter how long or hard they work, even if there is no direct correlation between chess skill and IQ.

As I've said, even with restrictions on time, resources and dedication taken out of the way not everyone has the capacity.  Simply stated there is a certain depth of concentration and complexity of calculation required that not everyone possesses the capacity for.

It's also important to remember is that IQ is a relatively one-dimensional measure of mental acuity that doesn't take many other cognitive capabilities into account and that the tests also tend to be quite culturally biased.  Even so, I'm curious who these below-average masters are.

 I used the test as an example. The point is not every master was by the worlds definition intelligent. They in fact knew how to play chess, which is a skill that is aqcuired. Intelligence does not having any bearing on the game of chess. In fact it is an understanding of the game not how smart you are. I know expert level players back home who aren't that bright they just took time to learn to calculate and understand the various positions. Chess is alot of memorization which does not take intelligence

In fact declaring that someone not intelligent can't make it is a very bold and assumptious statement. You can't account for every master level player of being of average intelligence.

The thought that intelligence matters comes from cultural bias that chess players are smart.

Why must you disillusion folks with the truth?  Bummer.

But you must account for some individuals who simply don't possess the capacity for master level play.  That was, after all, the question posed.

ManicDragon, I know you're beginning to get that familiar feeling....

 I agree, but I think that personal coaching would probably be necessary. Books, computer programs and experience certainly help a lot, but these cannot accurately hone in on one's personal deficiencies. A good personal coach could pinpoint your weaknesses and show you how to overcome them. Kasparov, Magnus's personal coach, has undoubtedly contributed much to his performance.

 They are accounted for yes, but there are plenty of not so bright people who can make master. Now will they? Probably not because they don't want to dedicate themselves to chess.

The question you asked was "Do you think it is impossible to achieve a master title for some people?" not "What's the lower bound of intelligence for the capacity to achieve a Master title"?

It doesn't really matter in either case, though, because it's clear that what you really want is a debate, not an answer to your question.