Ivanchuck Doping Hearing

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22nd January 2009, 04:25am
#1
by sstteevveenn
Wales United Kingdom
Member Since: Dec 2007
Member Points: 1634

"Wijk aan Zee (NED), January 21, 2009



Drug testing is still relatively rare in chess. However, it does occur in various official events and was carried out during the course of the Dresden Olympiad. Unfortunately, a high proportion of the tests were scheduled during the last round and there was a lack of personnel, which lead to a procedural error: there was not a designated Doping Control Officer present at this match (USA v Ukraine).

 

After losing a crucial game for his country, Mr Ivanchuk was distraught. The Hearing Panel concludes that although the arbiter attempted to inform Mr Ivanchuk in English that he should accompany him for a doping test, Mr Ivanchuk apparently failed to understand the instructions, especially since English is not Mr Ivanchuk’s first language. If there had been a Doping Control Officer present, he would have immediately gone to Mr Ivanchuk’s board and there would have been communication between him and Mr Ivanchuk. In that case the outcome might have been different. Because there was no notification by the Doping Control officer, there was no refusal in the sense of the regulations.

 

The Conclusion:

 

The procedural error allied with Mr Ivanchuk’s state of mind led him unintentionally to miss the test. The Hearing Panel therefore concludes unanimously that there should be no penalty."


 

lol... just... LOL

22nd January 2009, 04:28am
#2
by Smartattack
Portugal
Member Since: Jul 2007
Member Points: 874

I expected this outcome.However from now on will be harder to enforce the antidoping laws.

22nd January 2009, 04:38am
#3
by sstteevveenn
Wales United Kingdom
Member Since: Dec 2007
Member Points: 1634

I also expected this outcome and believe any other outcome would have been ridiculous.  Almost as ridiculous as the contrived "reasoning" given here. 

22nd January 2009, 08:49am
#4
by Smartattack
Portugal
Member Since: Jul 2007
Member Points: 874
sstteevveenn wrote:

I also expected this outcome and believe any other outcome would have been ridiculous.  Almost as ridiculous as the contrived "reasoning" given here. 


 I strongly believe that Ivanchuk was "clean".But we must now think that under this FIDE resolution anyone can refuse to take the doping test.

22nd January 2009, 08:55am
#5
by Ziryab
Spokane, Washington United States
Member Since: Nov 2007
Member Points: 1339

What is contrived? There is no evidence that Ivanchuk knew that he was being asked to submit to a doping test.

22nd January 2009, 09:03am
#6
by NM Reb
Lisbon Portugal
Member Since: Sep 2007
Member Points: 4042
Ziryab wrote:

What is contrived? There is no evidence that Ivanchuk knew that he was being asked to submit to a doping test.


 He knew......there were people following him around trying to get him to pee in a cup , dont kid yourself. I knew something like this would happen if it concerned one of the "stars" of chess. If Ivanchuk isnt punished its an injustice to ALL who were in the past and is an outrage.  It states that the "stars" are not treated like everyone else , even where the rules are concerned. This is NOT good for chess.

22nd January 2009, 09:28am
#7
by Smartattack
Portugal
Member Since: Jul 2007
Member Points: 874
Reb wrote:
Ziryab wrote:

What is contrived? There is no evidence that Ivanchuk knew that he was being asked to submit to a doping test.


 He knew......there were people following him around trying to get him to pee in a cup , dont kid yourself. I knew something like this would happen if it concerned one of the "stars" of chess. If Ivanchuk isnt punished its an injustice to ALL who were in the past and is an outrage.  It states that the "stars" are not treated like everyone else , even where the rules are concerned. This is NOT good for chess.


 Absolutely!FIDE lost all power to enforce the antidoping law.Everyone can feel free to take some doping and when asked to submit the test..just punch some walls and kick a couple of doors..pretend you are angry with your game..you should escape.Seriously,another blunder by FIDE.

22nd January 2009, 09:38am
#8
by JetSetter
United States
Member Since: Aug 2007
Member Points: 195

Actually this is outstanding news because it gains momentum for the players and weakens the position of the chess politicians. If the World's Top 10 can skip a test, eventually the World 100 and so on can do so.

Peeing into cups will not get chess into the Olympics, which is the only reason why the tests exist today. Continuing down this path is stupidity.

22nd January 2009, 09:50am
#9
by Tom
Texas United States
Member Since: Dec 2007
Member Points: 1031

So if Chucky isn't clean, what do you think is in him?  Also, does anyone know the list of banned substances?

22nd January 2009, 09:54am
#10
by Smartattack
Portugal
Member Since: Jul 2007
Member Points: 874
Tom543 wrote:

So if Chucky isn't clean, what do you think is in him?  Also, does anyone know the list of banned substances?


 Matter here isn t if he was clean or not.He had to suffer consequences for not taking the test.

22nd January 2009, 09:56am
#11
by Ziryab
Spokane, Washington United States
Member Since: Nov 2007
Member Points: 1339
Reb wrote:
Ziryab wrote:

What is contrived? There is no evidence that Ivanchuk knew that he was being asked to submit to a doping test.


 He knew......there were people following him around trying to get him to pee in a cup , dont kid yourself. I knew something like this would happen if it concerned one of the "stars" of chess. If Ivanchuk isnt punished its an injustice to ALL who were in the past and is an outrage.  It states that the "stars" are not treated like everyone else , even where the rules are concerned. This is NOT good for chess.


I agree that it is unjust to those that have been punished, but nothing about doping is good for chess. It's not against the rules to load up on sashimi, which is one of the few "substances" that might conceivably improve performance.

Perhaps it takes a "star" to "just say no" to drug testing, and a technicality to bring some sanity to the process.

Nearly everything FIDE does weakens its authority.

22nd January 2009, 10:04am
#12
by ewanyengi
glasgow Scotland
Member Since: Sep 2008
Member Points: 298

A LAW FOR THE CATS AND A LAW FOR THE RATS

22nd January 2009, 10:05am
#13
by D_Blackwell
United States
Member Since: Oct 2008
Member Points: 178

FIDE politics at work as usual.  This is NOT good for chess.  Was he guilty and nearly caught for a substance, or just a primo uomo above the rules?  We'll probably never know.


Trying to get chess in the Olympics is a huge waste of time and money, IMO.  How many thousands of chess sets, books, CDs, and tournament and coaching support could be distributed around the world instead?  The long term benefit to the game would be much greater.


What is contrived? There is no evidence that Ivanchuk knew that he was being asked to submit to a doping test.

We're supposed to believe he is that stupid? C'mon!  All of the initial onsite reports indicated that they did everything to get the test done but take him into custody.  He simply refused, and by the rules should have been banned.

22nd January 2009, 10:07am
#14
by Drcruiser
Ohio United States
Member Since: May 2008
Member Points: 45

I fail to see how a chess player could improve his performance by taking drugs. The case could be made that you might increase stamina through substances such as caffeen, but banning caffeen would be ridiculous.

22nd January 2009, 10:09am
#15
by JetSetter
United States
Member Since: Aug 2007
Member Points: 195
Tom543 wrote:

So if Chucky isn't clean, what do you think is in him?  Also, does anyone know the list of banned substances?


The banned substances FIDE uses is the list generated from the International Olympic Committee (IOC). Again, all in a vain attempt to get into the Olympics. There is nothing about dope testing that supports chess.

Smartattack wrote:

Matter here isn t if he was clean or not.He had to suffer consequences for not taking the test.


The IOC penalty (and FIDE uses the IOC rules) for refusing a test is to ban that player for a year. A Year! Chucky is #3 in the world, are you going to refuse him the right to play (and take away his livelyhood) because of a STUPID misguided system? The "rules are rules" argument doesn't hold water; FIDE has never upheld its own rules to a high standard so why should the players?

22nd January 2009, 10:21am
#16
by rollingpawns
Canada
Member Since: Sep 2008
Member Points: 193

Leave Chucky alone. 20 years ago he was #3 and still #3. You can't require an artist to pee in the bottle, he is an artist. He is not a sprinter, swimmer, etc., he just plays chess, that's all he can do and he does it well, so we, poor patzers, can learn something from his games. Maybe he ate a piece of chocolate, don't know what else can improve your performance in chess. I am glad FIDE realized all that, later better than never.

22nd January 2009, 10:22am
#17
by JDudar
Winnipeg Canada
Member Since: Jul 2008
Member Points: 638
Drcruiser wrote:

I fail to see how a chess player could improve his performance by taking drugs. The case could be made that you might increase stamina through substances such as caffeen, but banning caffeen would be ridiculous.


From what I can find, caffeine is listed as a banned substance if concentration in urine is greater than 12 micrograms per millilitre.

Edit: Also, things such as ephedrine can be used as a concentration aid.  I'm not saying chess is getting into the olympics, I'm simply saying that there are some cases where drugs may actually help players.

 

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