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Playing toward a critical moment: A good strategy for chess?


  • 22 months ago · Quote · #1

    VirtualMichael

    Single positions are within our capacity to visualize. It seems we all want to strategize toward a critical moment in which it would be hard for the opponent to deliberate on a move that would make the difference between his/her advantage and falling into the pit of disadvantage.

    Computers have tremendous potential to evaluate positions and look forward to them. Some say the wisest chess engine is Houdini. For instance, this game (that could be Houdini's Immortal) inspires me to think that maybe what we should do is think toward "critical moments" and value them somewhat more than mere materiality.
     
    This game between Rybka and Houdini (which Rybka lost!) seemed to be Houdini making advantageous moves at first. But Shredder makes it clear to me that Houdini was NOT at an advantage until after Rybka made a wrong move here: Rybka has to move his knight away from f5's attack and has possibilities (one of which Rybka played and should have regretted if it were human):

    Shredder says Nf2, which Rybka played, made a difference between keeping its advantage and falling into the pit of disadvantage, which Houdini then exploited and won with its new-found advantage. Houdini sacrificed pawns like crazy (relative material apathy for a computer). But it's as if Houdini could have seen a critical moment that was sharp and deciding to go for it.

    Indeed, Houdini plays weird before f5 attacking the knight on e4. But maybe Houdini is so positionally well versed that it sees how the unclear position could have an advantage to it.

    So have we been too materialistic and should think it's more correct to play in a way where we force our opponent to make moves--moves that play into our plot of "zugzwang forcing" via aggressive tactics that create new questions in a position that an opponent can easily answer wrong?

  • 22 months ago · Quote · #2

    VirtualMichael

    Anybody else like the idea of getting their opponent in an unclear/potentially zugzwangy position?

  • 22 months ago · Quote · #3

    Elubas

    It's interesting to see how houdini was willing to sacrifice two pawns, only for what seems to be actively placed pieces. Although like any computer it can be victim to the horizon effect, it doesn't seem to be a very materialistic engine.

  • 22 months ago · Quote · #4

    VirtualMichael

    I wasn't trying to make a Houdini commentary thread. I was more interested in the validity of playing for a sharp, critical moment like the above position that I posted seems to be. Where would you have moved that knight that was on e4? Notice that it's not the computer playing Black that has to answer that question, so the computer playing White was the one that got a chance to screw up.

  • 22 months ago · Quote · #5

    Yereslov

    Where would the knight go after 1.Ng3 or 1.Nd2?

  • 22 months ago · Quote · #6

    superking500

    hey, Yereslov my apologizes for calling you out, im sorry man

  • 22 months ago · Quote · #7

    Yereslov

    superking500 wrote:

    hey, Yereslov my apologizes for calling you out, im sorry man

    It doesn't really matter in the long run.

  • 22 months ago · Quote · #8

    VirtualMichael

    Yereslov wrote:

    Where would the knight go after 1.Ng3 or 1.Nd2?

    Ng5 may be the best.

  • 22 months ago · Quote · #9

    AndyClifton

    VirtualMichael wrote:
    Single positions are within our capacity to visualize. It seems we all want to strategize toward a critical moment in which it would be hard for the opponent to deliberate on a move that would make the difference between his/her advantage and falling into the pit of disadvantage.

    At last I have heard the sound of one hand clapping.

  • 22 months ago · Quote · #10

    VirtualMichael

    AndyClifton wrote:
    VirtualMichael wrote:
    Single positions are within our capacity to visualize. It seems we all want to strategize toward a critical moment in which it would be hard for the opponent to deliberate on a move that would make the difference between his/her advantage and falling into the pit of disadvantage.

    At last I have heard the sound of one hand clapping.

    Yes, use chess moves in a way to pose zen questions to your opponent in chess position form.

  • 22 months ago · Quote · #11

    AndyClifton

    Such as, "What was the position before the game started?"

  • 22 months ago · Quote · #12

    VirtualMichael

    Nah, attack accurately placed pieces and force them into less accurate places.

  • 22 months ago · Quote · #13

    AndyClifton

    Precisely.

  • 22 months ago · Quote · #14

    Estragon

    Why do I not see Andy's avatar?

    Do I need to raise my conciousness another level?

  • 22 months ago · Quote · #15

    Doggy_Style

    Estragon wrote:

    Why do I not see Andy's avatar?

    Do I need to raise my conciousness another level?

    Nah, just put your glasses on.

  • 22 months ago · Quote · #16

    Estragon

    Doggy_Style wrote:
    Estragon wrote:

    Why do I not see Andy's avatar?

    Do I need to raise my conciousness another level?

    Nah, just put your glasses on.

    He's back . . . everyone's back!

    I may have been abducted by aliens, must check for probes, back soon . . .

  • 22 months ago · Quote · #17

    VirtualMichael

    Romantic style of chess: Houdini telling us to go back to it?


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