Does this mean that positional/strategic skill can trump tactical skill? I find that hard to believe. Was Karpov so weak tactically to be out of the top 10?
Top 10 Best Tactical Players of All Time
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Smartattack wrote:
Petrosian wasn t surely spectacular player, but his tactics of constraining opponent moves and slowly get small advantages was legendary.
Petrosian was quite capable of spectacular tactics when the occasion called for it.
Euwe
Metaknight251 wrote:
I remember a joke about that.... "If tal makes a sacrifice against you, accept it, offer a draw, and pray. If petrosian makes a sacrifice against you, don't waste time. Resign immediately."
Which suggests Petrosian should be ranked above Tal? Or not?
1. Kasparov is the best tactical player
This is tough.
In no particular order:
Alekhine, Shirov, Fischer, Karpov, Kasparov, Petrosian, Korchnoi, Tal, Kramnik, Anand, Aronian, Topalov, Carlsen.
I know, that's a baker's dozen, but each deserve special recognition. If I were to drop some names from that very short list, the first two I'd drop are Alekhine and Shirov! I don't know who I'd drop next from that list. Perhaps Tal!
It takes more tactical vision to defend well than to attack well!
Let me see....I would choose Tal, Alekhine, Nezhmetdinov, Kasparov and throw in some Morphy for me.
northsea wrote:
My top is:
1.Tal
2.Alekhine
3.Morphy
Totally agreed!
SmyslovFan wrote:
This is tough.
In no particular order:
Alekhine, Shirov, Fischer, Karpov, Kasparov, Petrosian, Korchnoi, Tal, Kramnik, Anand, Aronian, Topalov, Carlsen.
I know, that's a baker's dozen, but each deserve special recognition. If I were to drop some names from that very short list, the first two I'd drop are Alekhine and Shirov! I don't know who I'd drop next from that list. Perhaps Tal!
It takes more tactical vision to defend well than to attack well!
Are you sure, do you know what a tactical player is ? Kramnik and Karpov are totally positional players. And Carlsen is more likely a positional player. I have no idea about Petrosian, Aronian and Korchnoi's styles.
anand
Its a shame Rossolimo is so unknown
Here's my list in no particular order:
Kasparov,Tal,Alekhine seem right, I HAVE to put Petrosian in there. Now it gets a little harder...Leonid Stein and Efim Geller are 2 underrated tacticians. Lasker was known for being resourceful in tough situations. Many people do not realize what an excellent tactician Karpov was. Chigorin is a must. Perhaps Janowsky and Spielmann can round off this list.
EDIT:Somehow I forgot Spassky. Let's call him #11. :)
Anyone who has watched recent tournaments knows that the top players are far more concrete calculators than the players in the past. Spassky lost quite a few games due to really weak tactics (for someone at his level). He really was probably the weakest match-play world champion since World War II. (Still, he was world champion, and deservedly so, as opposed to those who won some knock-out tournament and got a title).
I stand by my claim that Kramnik was one of the greatest tacticians, along with Petrosian. Being a tactician does not necessarily mean being an all-out attacker. Petrosian, Karpov, and Kramnik all used their incredible tactical skills to solve their defensive problems. But Kramnik, even more than Karpov (who won more tournaments than any other elite player), also uses his tactics to attack. Kramnik is a complete player.
SmyslovFan wrote:
Anyone who has watched recent tournaments knows that the top players are far more concrete calculators than the players in the past. Spassky lost quite a few games due to really weak tactics (for someone at his level). He really was probably the weakest match-play world champion since World War II. (Still, he was world champion, and deservedly so, as opposed to those who won some knock-out tournament and got a title).
I stand by my claim that Kramnik was one of the greatest tacticians, along with Petrosian. Being a tactician does not necessarily mean being an all-out attacker. Petrosian, Karpov, and Kramnik all used their incredible tactical skills to solve their defensive problems. But Kramnik, even more than Karpov (who won more tournaments than any other elite player), also uses his tactics to attack. Kramnik is a complete player.
its nice when you look at all the great things only , but if you take into account that half the moves are already double checked by computers and if you look at all the games with blunders or mistakes i dont know that is really the case
dont get me wrong Kramnik is a really strong player, i cant judge his strength maybe he is the best or one of the best i dont know.
But look at his game against ivanchuk, what was the playing???
Even if he played for a win that game looked really strange to me, people always forget about all the bad games played today and only see the good games nowadays and from the past all the bad games are forever in the collective memory.
Also i cant judge the quality of the games, but the game Svidler and Grischuk also looked very weird.
Radjabovs blunder against Carlsen and Carlsen inaccuracy agains Radjabov....
Not to mention Carlsens mistake against Ivanchuk and Svidler slightly inaccurate play against Ivanchuk...
I wouldnt say players are more concret calculators nowadays.
Ofc they can play more concrete computer lines and also use techniques Fischer invented and put to use manoveurs others invented, but when it comes to calculation i dont think they are necessarily more concrete calculators.
Even the Position were Kasparov failed against Deep Blue, i cant judge it, but i believe it would have been possible to calculate even for earlier players. But then again maybe im wrong. That is just my personal opinion.
goldendog wrote:
Define tactician. Fischer wasn't a speculative player but could calculate the hell out of a position (the only thing Botvinnik allowed after Fischer won the title). Fischer just didn't play wildly (as a rule). People still wonder about game #1 of the Spassky match in 1972.
you would think that is obvious but people love to ignore that fact
anand is in that list?
fischer isn't??
sorry what?
quadriple wrote:
anand is in that list?
fischer isn't??
sorry what?
Fischer and Anand are both in my list.
1. Tal
2. Alekhine
3. Fischer
4. Petrosian
5. Spassky
6. Botvinnik
7. Kasparov
8. Capablanca
9. Shirov
10. Judit Polgar