this site is getting bigger everyday and attracts popularity as one of the respected sites , there must be a strong mechanism to decide who are using engines in their matches and be very firm in getting them out , otherwise the reputation will decline , i am urgently asking the adminstration to set firm rules...sorry if the subject is not new but everyday we face such cheaters , they are increasing in number and getting more bold in using engines from opening till end games

what sort of rules are you proposing?

The rules are clear--engines are not permitted--the methods of discovering cheaters may be shrouded somewhat (a necessary component of their effectiveness).

we need to brainstorm it i dont propose anything ....just simply if someone proved cheating he should be kicked out or at least given warning if violated again then its final ....whatever , more important is there any mechanism that proves cheating? and what firm rules r given by the admin if someone proven to cheat ?

great to hear so .....thanks a lot de-lar

leo8160> we need to brainstor ....just simply if someone proved cheating he should be kicked out or at least given warning if violated again then its final

The rules are posted here, and yes, they spell out no chess engines. :)

http://support.chess.com/index.php?_m=knowledgebase&_a=viewarticle&kbarticleid=17

The admins seem to handle the situations quite fairly. For example, in most cases when they detect people cheating they ban them. But in one case, someone began a few games without realizing the rules, alerted the admins as soon as they found out, and instead of being banned he was warned and his games were resigned.

we do have methods of detecting and then banning cheaters. we have done it in the past and will continue to do so.

Implement a Digg-style voting mechanism.  After (and only after) playing a game with an opponent, you can give them a positive or negative vote, regardless of reason.  

This would never work. Everyone with an axe to grind or who is looking for a way to justify their losses will give everyone who beats them a negative rating. They may even give negative ratings when they win. Players rating each other is a bad idea and will only cause the legit players to leave the site when all the immature children get their egos bruised because they think they are hot chess players and then get beat and leave negatives for everyone they play.

Take it from a "LIFELONG" computer aided chess player/programmer/hacker: Chess cheating detection exists ONLY in the form of angry sore losers who repeatedly get their butt WHOOPED and complain to the admin that such and such players are TOO GOOD so they must be cheating. TRUST ME ON THIS FOLKS. There is NO FORM of technology that exists that is more accurate than the flip of a coin.

I have cheated at the best of the best chess sites on the web and IN PERSON and have fooled them ALL. I have fooled real life GMs on the www as well as sites that purport to have programs that can tell when one is cheating. What got me BANNED from ICC was me REPEATEDLY trouncing Master class players and my smart mouth.

A chess site can no more detect if I am using a chess program to make my moves than they can tell if I'm playing chess NAKED or not.

I always knew you weren't wearing anything underneath that trench-coat, Flasher_1.

leo8160 wrote:

everyday we face such cheaters , they are increasing in number and getting more bold in using engines from opening till end games

If you are going to make a claim like that, I would suggest that you post even one game that you think was played by someone cheating. If you can't post even one game that you claim was a cheat, how on earth can you support this claim that there are increasing numbers of cheaters.

From what I can see, the thing that keeps increasing is the number of unsubstantiated claims that people are cheating. I think the greatest threat to cause a decline in the reputation of Chess.com is the number of people claiming to know about this vast amount of cheating. Please put up even one game if there are so many.

If you can't, please, for the sake of this site, stop asserting that there is some massive cheating problem here.

I suggest a vote of members for 1 person to undertake this endeavor, and he may choose a few people to help him, but he may choose to keep his methods secret.

I vote for erik.

De-Lar wrote:

I agree this is turning into a wild goose chase.  Every where you look people are making claims of cheaters, yet I have yet to see one proven game of somebody cheating.  I have no doubt that some people do cheat, I just think this is being blown way out of proportion.

Actually, De-Lar, I've seen a lot more wild geese than I have substantiated cheaters on Chess.com.

i am satisfied knowing my 1583 is all me.  anyone who cheats ,they are cheating themselves.

I have been accused of cheating many times in the past, especially when I was first learning.  The reason for this is "spikes" of knowledge in my developement.  I would study a particular element in the game, such as an opening, and then sometimes the next day that line would come up.  My rating was low, but I just happened to know this little nitch of the game, which made me appear to be cheating.  Knowing the number of people that have accused me, totally convinced I was cheating, I would have to say that most suspicions are probably false.

You're never going to stop people from cheating, and you'll never be able to accurately predict who's cheating and whos not.  The very best you can hope for is a guess.  

The most obvious detection is if the person never loses, no?  Aren't the engines at near grandmaster strength?  So a person using one should play at about that level.

Some people use engines only to help with a move or two, so that would be much harder to detect.  

Can anyone here produce a game where they feel someone cheated and explain why?  It would be interesting to see.

i cant work out whats sadder.....the person who uses computers to cheat on chess.com, or the person who upon being beaten assumes the other player is cheating and has a little blog cry

harden up princess, its a game.

Peedee wrote:Can anyone here produce a game where they feel someone cheated and explain why?  It would be interesting to see.

 That's a good idea.

Tunatin wrote:

I'm just glad that somebody finally started a thread about cheating.

Is that be cause the numerous prior threads on cheating were not enough?

Please post even one game you have played -- or anyone has played -- that you even suspect was cheating.

Duffer1965 wrote:

Tunatin wrote:

I'm just glad that somebody finally started a thread about cheating.

Is that be cause the numerous prior threads on cheating were not enough?

Please post even one game you have played -- or anyone has played -- that you even suspect was cheating.

I think Tunatin is being ironic... :-)