White against the siciliian: 2.c3

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22nd June 2009, 01:51pm
#21
by marvellosity
Portsmouth United Kingdom
Member Since: May 2009
Member Points: 1499

It's ridiculous to say you get the same attacking chances and lead in development with the mainline Sicilian as the Morra.

Anyone who says that knows neither the mainlines Sicilians nor the Morra.

23rd June 2009, 07:23am
#22
by ericmittens
London, ON Canada
Member Since: Sep 2007
Member Points: 1876

My 2 cents.

As far as anti-sicilians go 2.c3 is probably the best, up there with the Bb5+ stuff.

Some good reading material on the line:

Starting Out: The c3 Sicilian by John Emms

Play the 2.c3 Sicilian by Harley and Rozentalis

Chess Explained: c3 Sicilian by Sam Collins

I think it's a good choice for white players who want decent positions but don't have the millenia of study-time required to play the open sicilians.

13th July 2009, 07:38pm
#23
by SukerPuncher333
Canada
Member Since: Nov 2008
Member Points: 581
gambitattack wrote:

The point being is that I want to take my opponent out of his 'comfort zone' as soon as possible and start making him play in positions that he's unfamiliar with. It's a strategy that has served me well in the past. My opening repertoire consists of mainly sidelines. Also, I don't have much time for main line studying! =)


Even though 2. c3 isn't the mainline, it's still quite popular, so sicilian players would be prepared for that. It's just too "good" to be used as a surprise weapon to take someone away from their comfort zone. People will expect it. I'm a sicilian player, and 2. c3 is like the second most popular move after the mainline!

You need something gambity or strange, like a wing gambit, or maybe 2...b3.

13th July 2009, 08:01pm
#24
by Shivsky
DFW United States
Member Since: Jun 2009
Member Points: 597

I've started walking down the very same path. Ditching the Morra for the c3.  All things being said about what is good, what is good enough or what isn't are fine...but if you are at a rating level that warrants a shift to grown-up openings, haven't you figured out that all the openings are (at this level you are probably at) is a way to survive into the middle-game with at least an equal position?

Surely you don't expect to trap a strong club player or expert every single time just because he didn't book up a suprise weapon? Seriously ... you guys ought to give the strong players out here a little more respect :)

14th July 2009, 04:48am
#25
by RainbowRising
United Kingdom
Member Since: Oct 2008
Member Points: 3065

Morra-Smith all the way.

14th July 2009, 04:57am
#26
by Scarblac
Arnhem Netherlands
Member Since: Nov 2008
Member Points: 1841

I wish people would stop dissuading people from playing the Morra. We Black players like the free pawn.

14th July 2009, 05:00am
#27
by RainbowRising
United Kingdom
Member Since: Oct 2008
Member Points: 3065
14th July 2009, 05:15am
#28
by marvellosity
Portsmouth United Kingdom
Member Since: May 2009
Member Points: 1499
Scarblac wrote:

I wish people would stop dissuading people from playing the Morra. We Black players like the free pawn.


Do you Black players also like the 10% record you have vs me when I venture the Morra?

14th July 2009, 05:16am
#29
by RainbowRising
United Kingdom
Member Since: Oct 2008
Member Points: 3065

And game I just played using the morra smith. Giving that half of you probably aren't up to this level, perhaps it's not such a bad opening ;)

14th July 2009, 05:23am
#30
by marvellosity
Portsmouth United Kingdom
Member Since: May 2009
Member Points: 1499

Bf4 and Bd3 is wrong though, RR. In that game, 5.Nf3 and then if 5...Bb4, 6.Qd4! is strong.

14th July 2009, 05:30am
#31
by Scarblac
Arnhem Netherlands
Member Since: Nov 2008
Member Points: 1841
marvellosity wrote:
Scarblac wrote:

I wish people would stop dissuading people from playing the Morra. We Black players like the free pawn.


Do you Black players also like the 10% record you have vs me when I venture the Morra?


 Challenge issued & accepted :)

14th July 2009, 05:30am
#32
by RainbowRising
United Kingdom
Member Since: Oct 2008
Member Points: 3065

But im only 2000 not 2200 like you ( CC ratings )... But I'll improve!

14th July 2009, 05:38am
#33
by marvellosity
Portsmouth United Kingdom
Member Since: May 2009
Member Points: 1499

Ya, I'm not telling you to criticise, only to inform :)

I know pretty much everything about the Morra there is to know, I think.

I even have my own novelty that I played and won with against a 2200-2300 player here a month or so ago :D

14th July 2009, 08:15am
#34
by RainbowRising
United Kingdom
Member Since: Oct 2008
Member Points: 3065

Sorry - I  wasn't clear - I appreciate you informing me!

If that is true, would you help me learn it through and through? I really enjoy playing it :D. I've been looking at the games of Milan Matulovic and they have been instructive, but 1 to 1 would be even better!

14th July 2009, 08:47am
#35
by Ricardo_Morro
Bridgeport, CT United States
Member Since: Oct 2007
Member Points: 649

Why not try the Wing Attack, 2. b4?

14th July 2009, 09:02am
#36
by marvellosity
Portsmouth United Kingdom
Member Since: May 2009
Member Points: 1499

RR - could do, not sure how that would work here :)

Wing gambit is poo :p

14th July 2009, 01:41pm
#37
by Elubas
Buffalo United States
Member Since: Aug 2008
Member Points: 2600
Scarblac wrote:

And the Morra... white sacs a pawn to get the same attacking chances and lead in development that he gets in the open sicilian anyway. It's really bad.


Lol yeah, It seems like the only difference is that white gets the c file for possible use and maybe one extra piece out but the c file doesn't have much to do with a kingside attack though it may prevent black from using it so it does seem the same as the open. Although I don't think it's a good choice for white, it is very trappy I saw a line that was very natural something that I would play if I didn't know the lines and it leads to a forced loss so it at least needs study just in case someone tries it.

14th July 2009, 01:55pm
#38
by Gonnosuke
Southern California Germany
Member Since: Feb 2008
Member Points: 2590
marvellosity wrote:
Scarblac wrote:

I wish people would stop dissuading people from playing the Morra. We Black players like the free pawn.


Do you Black players also like the 10% record you have vs me when I venture the Morra?


It's true that very few players seem to know how to handle the black side of Morra but when you play someone who knows the theory, you're really going to want your pawn back....

As far as anti-Sicilians go, the Alapin is the one that I hate to see.

14th July 2009, 02:00pm
#39
by NM ozzie_c_cobblepot
United States
Member Since: Feb 2008
Member Points: 3846

I looked at the theory behind the S-M awhile back and it seems to be yet another unsound gambit.

If I played 1.e4 I would think that the 2.c3 Sicilian would be my best bet, but I'd probably need to buy a book on it.

Maybe I can just "wing" my way through the open Sicilian. Can't be too hard.

14th July 2009, 02:07pm
#40
by Gonnosuke
Southern California Germany
Member Since: Feb 2008
Member Points: 2590
ozzie_c_cobblepot wrote:

I looked at the theory behind the S-M awhile back and it seems to be yet another unsound gambit.


Unsound is too harsh in my opinion.  Like the King's Gambit, it's ineffectual if black knows the theory and lethal if he doesn't.  Few people seem to know the theory which is why many players report phenomenal results when they play it.  As soon as you start regularly encountering an early e6/a6, the Smith-Morra loses much of it's appeal....


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