An interesting pet opening I discovered, what are your thoughts?

DeirdreSkye

It isn't really  important what Stockfish says. Stockfish has no problem playing an unpleasant position or ruining a pleasant one. It doesn't even know what "pleasant" is.An average player will reject 5...Bxe5 without much thinking.It is unecessary.

    Nevertheless, if blitz is the goal, everything is playable and far worst things have been tried succesfully.

 

DeirdreSkye
IMBacon wrote:
mecuelgalapieza wrote:

Sf gives 5...Bxe5 as its second option, behind 5...Nh6 and ahead (not really, almost the same eval) 5...Nd7, so Bxe5 is not horrible at all, and could be the option if the black player likes endgames (but then he wouldn´t probably had chosen 1...g6 against 1.e4)

Im gonna ask the obvious question..."Why" does stockfish like 5...Be5.

I have seen Svidler many times doing exactly the same question for other moves.If Svidler can't explain engine's moves don't expect that we will.

congrandolor
IMBacon wrote:
mecuelgalapieza wrote:

Sf gives 5...Bxe5 as its second option, behind 5...Nh6 and ahead (not really, almost the same eval) 5...Nd7, so Bxe5 is not horrible at all, and could be the option if the black player likes endgames (but then he wouldn´t probably had chosen 1...g6 against 1.e4)

Im gonna ask the obvious question..."Why" does stockfish like 5...Be5.

The Bg7 is a monster, but the Ne5 also, so you don´t exchange one bad piece for a good one, but two good, in addition you prevent white from casling, that is the positional explanation, maybe SF has tactical reasons as well to prefer that move

DeirdreSkye
mecuelgalapieza wrote:
IMBacon wrote:
mecuelgalapieza wrote:

Sf gives 5...Bxe5 as its second option, behind 5...Nh6 and ahead (not really, almost the same eval) 5...Nd7, so Bxe5 is not horrible at all, and could be the option if the black player likes endgames (but then he wouldn´t probably had chosen 1...g6 against 1.e4)

Im gonna ask the obvious question..."Why" does stockfish like 5...Be5.

The Bg7 is a monster, but the Ne5 also, so you don´t exchange one bad piece for a good one, but two good, in addition you prevent white from casling, that is the positional explanation, maybe SF has tactical reasons as well to prefer that move

 Ne5 is a monster but also a target while Bg7 is a good piece but not a target.

The Bxe5 exchange is fundamentally wrong in my opinion since in the long run White will be forced to retreat the knight or exchange with another knight effectively losing a tempo.

   

DeirdreSkye

I run Stockfish in the well known other site I can't mention and in 34 depth 5...Nd7 is evaluated -0.4 while 5...Bxe5 is second but very far behind (-0.2)

  So according to Stockfish mathematics 5...Nd7 is almost 2 times better than 5...Bxe5. That is good enough for me. Basically Stockfish says that 5...Nd7 is clearly the best  but there is no other SECOND BEST than 5...Bxe5 something that I can believe.

     Maybe the evaluations change later but it doesn't really matter because higher depth has no practical value(34 is already way too high). 

IMBacon
nighteyes1234
sololib wrote:

So this pet opening arises after the moves 1. e4 g6 2. d4 Bg7 3. Nf3 d6. The opening starts with 4. e5 !?. Everybody and their mother will play dxe4 here so I will discuss that line. After 4. ... dxe5 5. Nxe5 Bxe5 6. dxe5 Qxd1 7. Kxd1 we arrive at this position:

 

So the idea behind losing the right to castle here as white here is it will be really hard for black to not lose the right to castle as well, his knight on the kingside is not going anywhere any time soon (and so does the rook) and on the queenside, you have ideas of Bb5, Rd1, Nb5. On top of that, you have a great dark-squared bishop and an annoying pawn for black to deal with.

 
What are your thoughts on this opening?

Black is moving 7...Nc6 and castling queenside. 8 Bb5 Bd7 9 Re1 O-O-O 10 Bd2.

 

 

 

 

iusegambits

I dunno, it seems like black needs to make a bunch of moves you expect him to for the opening to work ?

MickinMD

It may work well at lower levels, but you should focus on openings that can maintain White's advantage for a longer period against the higher ratings you hope to achieve and lead to solid middlegame strategies.

drmrboss
sololib wrote:

So this pet opening arises after the moves 1. e4 g6 2. d4 Bg7 3. Nf3 d6. The opening starts with 4. e5 !?. Everybody and their mother will play dxe4 here so I will discuss that line. After 4. ... dxe5 5. Nxe5 Bxe5 6. dxe5 Qxd1 7. Kxd1 we arrive at this position:

 

So the idea behind losing the right to castle here as white here is it will be really hard for black to not lose the right to castle as well, his knight on the kingside is not going anywhere any time soon (and so does the rook) and on the queenside, you have ideas of Bb5, Rd1, Nb5. On top of that, you have a great dark-squared bishop and an annoying pawn for black to deal with.

Here is an example game I played yesterday, where black decided his knight is going somewhere sometime soon by playing e6 and strengthening my bishop even more (I am pretty low rated so I know it's not the greatest of games, but still a bit unusual and fun to watch I think):

 
What are your thoughts on this opening?

95% of >1800 will not play 4. e5???? move (useless, terrible, waste of tempo,............ anything else???) . And 99% of >2000+ will not play 4. e5??????????

drmrboss

For OP, dont reinvent "the wheel". Learn how "wheels works" 

IMBacon
drmrboss wrote:

For OP, dont reinvent "the wheel". Learn how "wheels works" 

Well said Sir!