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Kings Gambit Keene defense!

  • #1
    I find this very uncomfortable to play against even though it's good for white. I find my kingside is weakened severely. What is the best way to play against this.
  • #2
    Bump
  • #3

    For those unaware what line he is talking about it is:

     

     

    It appeared in one of the later SOS books, I will have to dig it up in a bit and see.

  • #4

      I guess this is named after the British Grandmaster Raymond Keene, a rather interesting guy who played a lot of positional stuff. There's only a couple of his games in chessgames.com, with this line: a win and a draw. White's supposed to have a slight edge against this, but that's not saying much in an opening as wild and unpredictable as the KG.

        It's fun to try once in a while, especially as some KG players aren't too familiar with it. Black has a lot of tactical shots on the king file, but it is risky......

        This is a funny blitz game I played against a 1900+ player. I routinely get clobbered by this guy, so it was nice to win this one. Maybe he was drunk or somethingwink.png

     

  • #5

    I looked in my Shaw book and he thinks just about everything is good for white here but gives 4.d3 as the safest way to get an edge.

     

     

     

  • #6

    If white just wants to avoid trouble (but then why are they playing the King's Gambit?), they can reach a fairly boring queenless middlegame. Black has no good way to deviate.

     

  • #7
    melvinbluestone wrote:

      I guess this is named after the British Grandmaster Raymond Keene, a rather interesting guy who played a lot of positional stuff. There's only a couple of his games in chessgames.com, with this line: a win and a draw.

     

    The draw is in the line I posted. Thrilling stuff!

    http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1076860

  • #8

    Reading through the comments to that game, GM Keene himself had this to say about his variation:

    "i found this defence in an old edition of bilguier in my rooms in cambridge when i was a student-bilguier only gives e4 e5 f4 qh4+ g3 qe7 fxe5 qxe5

    4...d6 was my innovation which i first used in a game v sir stuart milner barry in cambridge 1971 i think. anyway-i have sent this game along with others to chessgames admin, i think 2..qh4+ is a viable defence. the game with anderssson was a last round effort in the nice olympiad england sweden match where all 4 games were quickly terminated in a package of draws."

  • #9

    I'll be back..... I'm eating dinner just now.

  • #10
    JSLigon wrote:
    melvinbluestone wrote:

      I guess this is named after the British Grandmaster Raymond Keene, a rather interesting guy who played a lot of positional stuff. There's only a couple of his games in chessgames.com, with this line: a win and a draw.

     

    The draw is in the line I posted. Thrilling stuff!

    http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1076860

       I didn't realize you were being sarcastic when you said "Thrilling stuff!"

            I agree: playing a 'safe' line as white in the KG is a bit contradictory. I think 4.Nc3 offers white a better chance to at least avoid the more drawish stuff with forced queen trades on the king file.

         This is a pretty interesting game I found in 365Chess. Black tries 4...Nf6 instead of d6 and it backfires big time.......

     

     

  • #11

    Just testing the internet sarcasm detectors with the "thrilling" comment. I've started playing the King's Gambit myself, so I ran the position after 1. e4 e5 2. f4 Qh4+ 3. g3 Qe7 through Stockfish. It gives white an advantage after any of white's fourth moves that have been discussed so far (Nc3, fxe5, d3) as well as Qe2, with Nc3 the top choice. The Nc3 lines seem most in the spirit of the King's Gambit, fxe5 is definitely the boring option, and d3 looks like a decent middleground. Though after the queen trade line stemming from 4. fxe5 I can't imagine white's supposed advantage would amount to much of anything (nor does Stockfish rate it as significant at the end of that line).

    Your comment after 4. Nc3: "I think either exf4 or d6 has to be played here"

    Stockfish agrees, and after what it considers best play for both sides, this is the evaluation.

    1. e4 e5 2. f4 Qh4+ 3. g3 Qe7 4. Nc3 exf4 5. d4 fxg3 6. Qf3

    6... d6 7. hxg3 c6 8. Nh3 h5 9. Bg5 Bg4 10. Qd3 f6 11. Be3 Nd7 12. Nf4 Qf7 13. Be2 Rh6 14. Qc4 Qxc4 15. Bxc4 g5 16. Bxg8 gxf4 17. Bxf4 Rh8 18. Bc4 O-O-O 19. Be2 Be7 20. Kd2 Bxe2 21. Nxe2 Nb6 22. Raf1 d5 23. exd5 c5 24. c3 Nxd5 25. Kc2 cxd4 26. Nxd4 Nxf4 27. Rxf4
    + (0.50) Depth=40/58 0:95:28 32228 MN

    6... c6 7. Bd2 gxh2 8. Rxh2 d6 9. O-O-O g6 10. Bc4 h5 11. Rf1 Nh6 12. Kb1 Bg4 13. Qd3 Nd7 14. Bxh6 Bxh6 15. Bxf7+ Kd8 16. Bxg6 Bg5 17. Bf5 Kc7 18. Bxg4 hxg4 19. Rg2 Rh4 20. Rgf2 Rf8 21. Rxf8 Nxf8 22. Qc4 Kb8 23. d5 c5 24. e5 dxe5 25. d6 Qd8 26. Ne4 Bf4 27. Ne2 Nd7 28. Qe6 g3 29. N4xg3 Bxg3 30. Nxg3 Rf4
    + (0.52) Depth=40/75 0:95:28 32228 MN

    6... gxh2 7. Rxh2 c6 8. Qg3 d6 9. Bg5 f6 10. Bd2 h5 11. Be2 Qf7 12. O-O-O Ne7 13. Nf3 Na6 14. Kb1 Bd7 15. Qxd6 Ng6 16. Qg3 O-O-O 17. d5 Bg4 18. dxc6 Nc5 19. Rhh1 bxc6 20. Be3 Rxd1+ 21. Rxd1 Qc7 22. Qf2 Qa5 23. Qg2 Nd7 24. Nd4 Nge5 25. a3 Bxe2 26. Qxe2 h4 27. Nb3 Qc7 28. Na4 h3 29. Ka1
    + (0.54) Depth=40/61 0:95:28 32228 MN

    6... Nc6 7. Be3 gxh2 8. Rxh2 d6 9. Nd5 Qd8 10. O-O-O Nf6 11. Bh3 Nxd5 12. exd5 Ne7 13. Bd2 f6 14. Qb3 Ng6 15. Qb5+ Kf7 16. Re1 Bxh3 17. Nxh3 Qc8 18. Qb3 Kg8 19. Rhe2 Rb8 20. Re6 Qd7 21. Kb1 Qf7 22. Qd3 Ne7 23. Qa3 a6 24. Qf3 c6 25. Nf4 h5 26. Bb4 Nxd5 27. Nxd5 cxd5 28. Qxd5 Rc8
    + (0.55) Depth=40/55 0:95:28 32228 MN

     

  • #12

        I certainly don't intend to argue with Stockfish. I'll leave that to AlphaZero.grin.png But a reasonable alternative to the engine's 'best play' line would be 4...d6, and after the exchange of pawns on e5 follow up with Nf6 and Nc6.

          But black's problem with the Keene Defense is the cluttered kingside, and the more tried n' true second moves are much less risky. However, if you're in an adventurous mood, this thing is worth a try, especially as some players may not be familiar with it. I mean it doesn't 'lose outright', and the last I heard is that for white, the KG just 'draws outright'.

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