# Is this impossible to win?

I was just in a tournament and this wasthe ending of my last game i couldnt for the life of me get that pawn promoted and the tournament official actually told me it was impossible. I had to have a draw and i want to know with white not being an idiot is it possible. Black to move

black has two spaces to go

Yes, impossible to win (with correct play from White), regardless of which side has the move.

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Well in low rated games you should play it out and see. Thats called learning.

I will assume it's Blacks move 1)...Ka3, if white makes the wrong move (2. Kc1) you could get your Q (2... Ka2) . If White make the correct move(2. Ka1) its a Draw.

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CrecyWar wrote:

Well in low rated games you should play it out and see. Thats called learning.

I will assume it's Blacks move 1)...Ka3, if white makes the wrong move (2. Kc1) you could get your Q (2... Ka2) . If White make the correct move(2. Ka1) its a Draw.

But white could also make a more subtle, and less obvious mistake too.  If black first plays king to A4, then it looks like white should play king to B2.  If white instead plays king to A1, then at this point black can play king to A3, and get opposition, and drive the king away, and promote the pawn, and win, correct?

Correct, Vance917.

If the pawn and king switched places, if my memory serves correct, it doesnt matter whose move it is.

Yes, impossible to win (with correct play from White), regardless of which side has the move.

I try and it's always draw if black moves

To promote pawn you need two out of three of the following:

1. Possess Opposition

2. Have King in front of pawn

3. Have pawn on 6th rank

P.S. This seems to be a necropost

how in bloody hell was this dug up from 13 months ago

I've no idea why Randomemory felt need to post it. Worst thing is his comment is even wrong as if the Black king and pawn switch places it's drawn if it's black to move

KMcGeoch wrote:

I've no idea why Randomemory felt need to post it. Worst thing is his comment is even wrong as if the Black king and pawn switch places it's drawn if it's black to move

No it isn't, it's winning with king on 6th pawn on 5th.

KMcGeoch wrote:

I've no idea why Randomemory felt need to post it. Worst thing is his comment is even wrong as if the Black king and pawn switch places it's drawn if it's black to move

Your lack of endgame knowledge here surprises me a bit, given that you are around 1500-1600. This is a very simple idea, the black king is in front of the pawn, and since the white king is on the back rank, opposition does not matter, even if it was black to move...

Take some time to think, next time, of an explanation of how I am wrong. Please.

Thank you for posting that Scottrf.

Correct me if I am wrong, but I think the variation that Scottrf showed only applies if the king is on the 6th rank, not on the other ranks before

Yes, pawn on 5th, king on 6th.

If the pawn hasn't yet reached the 5th rank the key squares for the attacking king are two ranks ahead of the pawn, and the two squares either side.

Basically what it boils down to is that if you can gain the opposition with the king in front of the pawn then you win. I can't think of any position where that doesn't hold true.

Well, yeah, but if the pawn is on the 5th you don't need opposition. The opposition is just a means to an end (occupying the key squares).