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KRPPPP vs KRNPP

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Erwinmk

Are the two pawns for White enough compensation in this situation? Black to move.

 

Erwinmk

By the way, this is how an actual game running now might end up. Therefore no comments might be given.

Nonetheless, I meanwhile found a better move for this game, keeping equal material.

So the question here is indeed... would two pawns compensate enough for further counterplay.

JackBirchwood
Yes.
banannna23

Nope. Black just needs activate his knight and it should be winning

tygxc

White trades pawns to get rid of pawn g7 and reaches a theoretically drawn endgame.

cellen01

I think this is a draw endgame, as a knight and a rook vs a rook is a draw with accurate play. And I believe the kingside majority with the passed pawn in the center will be causing a lot of troubles for black if played accurately. So in my opinion it is a draw. But it can pretty much be winning for black too.

KeSetoKaiba
Erwinmk wrote:

Are the two pawns for White enough compensation in this situation? Black to move.

Oh, I don't think so. There is a good amount of endgame left to play, but black should be winning here. I don't think high play should allow white to hold a draw. 

In endgames, usually the piece is better than 3 pawns, it is just that if the pawns are all exchanged then the piece is of course useful (K + N vs K and K + B vs K are draws by insufficient material as checkmate isn't possible). 

This endgame isn't even a piece for 3 pawns. It is a piece for 2 pawns. Black is better here. This is one possible endgame continuation beginning with ...Ke7 going until checkmate:

 

tygxc

@7
6 d4 is an uninspired defence. The pawn on d3 is no asset. Better seems 6 h5 intending g5 to trade pawns. If all pawns are eliminated then it is a draw despite the knight up.

KeSetoKaiba
tygxc wrote:

@7
6 d4 is an uninspired defence. The pawn on d3 is no asset. Better seems 6 h5 intending g5 to trade pawns. If all pawns are eliminated then it is a draw despite the knight up.

Nice insight. Admittingly, I was more trying to display how I believed the black pieces had a better endgame position, but yes perhaps that was a better defensive attempt for the white side happy.png

JamesColeman
tygxc wrote:

@7
6 d4 is an uninspired defence. The pawn on d3 is no asset. Better seems 6 h5 intending g5 to trade pawns. If all pawns are eliminated then it is a draw despite the knight up.

Not easy to actually trade all the pawns though -  Black won’t ever take by playing …hxg5 so it’s not clear how you actually get all the pawns off. 6.h5 Rd5 - and I don’t like whites chances.

My view about the initial position in general is that maybe - with near perfect play - white might hold a draw, but it’s certainly not ‘enough’ compensation in the sense of it being relatively balanced, Black is the one with the practical chances.

ceritacetta

I bet it's draw

tygxc

@10

"Black won’t ever take by playing …hxg5" ++ Then white locks up black with g6.

"6.h5 Rd5" ++ Then white just gives up pawn d3: 7 Ra7 Rxd3+ 8 Kg2 and black can make no progress. The pawn at h5 is essential, pawn d3 is just ballast.

KeSetoKaiba
tygxc wrote:

@10

"Black won’t ever take by playing …hxg5" ++ Then white locks up black with g6.

"6.h5 Rd5" ++ Then white just gives up pawn d3: 7 Ra7 Rxd3+ 8 Kg2 and black can make no progress. The pawn at h5 is essential, pawn d3 is just ballast.