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Is chess a sport? Ending the debate

  • #1581

     My response to Blockhead Bud.

    I don’t want to waste any more time with this pig ignorant individual. By the same token I don’t see why the mentally defective town drunk should be continually prominent on this thread. So once posted, I will occasionally copy and paste this to caution newcomers of this truly obnoxious individual. This I take on as a service to the chess.com community.

    He and many others argue that sport needs a physical component separate from the brain to be called ‘sport’. I am not unsympathetic to this viewpoint. However I believe a significant minority, including myself argue that chess is within our definition of sport. Numerous dictionaries include definitions of sport that don’t include vigorous movement. Blockhead Bud will not accept that there are certain words in English usage that can mean different things to different people.

    He continually misrepresents others points of view and accuses others of name calling while continually dishing it out himself. His contention that cerebral pursuits aren’t covered by dictionary definitions is a lie, and he knows it. At first, I admired his resoluteness, but after a while I realised I was dealing with a pig ignorant liar who is immune to reason.

  • #1582
    Smositional wrote:
    MintWarrior wrote:

    ok lets go into groups so we know who is on which side who to suport if you are on the sport side say SPORT if your not say ANTISPORT and if your unsure type 

    What do you mean by that? Should I write SPORT or ANTISPORT before I write my post. Shouldn't it be obvious from what people are posting?

    well actually no who knows what your supporting for if you say it needs physical strengt but then say its amental sport then after that say its a board game how are we supposed to know what side your on 

     

  • #1583
    AntonioEsfandiari wrote:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ftTsnsNXUGc
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StnAGJDBjfo  More chess "athletes" 
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sb9zFH9w8bI starts at 1:30, can you move this fast and accurately?
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AaZuoQAbu2E aspiring young athletes

    This is too easy, BKB.   Sorry that you have been debating this thread for 2 years in vain.  I know that I have covered a lot of information in a short time, and you are probably still absorbing it.  I will give it time to sink in and check on you from time to time to see if you have either evolved your argument or refuted chess being a sport.  You are a smart kid, I have high hopes for you!

     

    LMAO!!

     

    BigKingBud:  "I'm fucking 40-years-old you hard headed wanna-be."

     

    Rule: When one resorts to profanity and name-calling he or she loses the argument.  Since they have run out of counter arguments and rebuttals, the losing side resorts to crude cursing when they are lying flat on the canvas and hearing the number "9" on a 10-count.   

     

    The river card has been turned up and since both players are all-in, the championship pot and winner is Antonio!!

     

    Conclusively demonstrating that Chess is a Sport!!  Check and mate!

     

     

  • #1584
    BigKingBud wrote:

    IF the definition of sport was 

      an activity that requires effort, and some sort of skill

     

    I mean, that is what you(Antonio) are saying the definition says...

    The definition says,

      an activity that requires a bodily activity that can be honed physically...

    According to Antonio's interpretation of the definition of sport...

    ...a mechanic is an athlete, and working on cars can be a sport

    ...a baker is an athlete and baking cookies can be a sport

    ...a plumber

    ...a house builder

    ...a road paver

    ...an astronaut

    ...a computer repairman(any repairman)
    ...actually, pretty much any job that requires you to wake up and do something qualifies as a sport...

    Anyone that has spent over 2 days thinking about this, that still believes the definition of sport allows for chess to be included simply cannot read... 

    Plain and simple...

  • #1585
    SeniorPatzer wrote:

     Rule: When one resorts to profanity and name-calling he or she loses the argument.  

    Hey, look more of you chess-flat-earther(chess is a sport people) making up your own realities, rules and definitions...

    What a surprise...

  • #1586

    Antonio you do not know me but I know you!

    I learned off TV that you are one of the worlds top poker players and that you perform magic tricks. Like you (regularly), I once was featured on TV when I won a semi final of an 888 competition. My point is that my poker play was shown on Sky Sports UK TV station, and although 80 years old, I consider myself a 'sportsman'.

  • #1587

    @happymaxy I'm just a huge fan of Antonio, I am not the great magician himself!  @BKB a mechanic COULD be an athlete, if there were timed car repair competitions with teams and spectators.  Baking cookies could also be a sport if there were timed competitions with spectators haha.   If you turn ANYTHING into a skilled game with competitions and spectators then viola! You have an argument for a sport.  My interpretation of the definition is 

    sport
    spôrt/
    noun
     
    1. 1.
      an activity involving physical exertion and skill in which an individual or team competes against another or others for entertainment.


      Anything that can be argued to fit under these conditions is possibly a sport.  
  • #1588

    https://www.fide.com/fide/fide-world-chess-federation.html  117 countries recognize chess as a sport.   Just because the physical effort in chess is minimal does not mean it is non-existent.   The faster chess you play, the more physical skill required, the slower you play, it is lessened.  It is all on a spectrum.  For example, 1 minute chess is quite physical, especially with a real board and pieces, 10 second chess is EXTREMELY physical, even as an e-sport, you have to fine tune "motor skills" to get the pieces on the right squares, premove rapidly, etc.  
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=miRioF6OV98&t=17s See how fast they are moving the pieces?  Try and argue that is not physical exertion and/or fine motor skills.  
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2AMN9tHSB0 this requires a lot more proficiency in mouse skills than 99% of esports.  
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bzrap8Vtyq8 Do you have the physical skill required to move the pieces to the right squares this fast? 
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ftTsnsNXUGc
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StnAGJDBjfo  More chess "athletes" 
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sb9zFH9w8bI starts at 1:30, can you move this fast and accurately?
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AaZuoQAbu2E aspiring young athletes

  • #1589
    AntonioEsfandiari wrote:
    sport
    spôrt/
    noun
     
    1. 1.
      an activity involving physical exertion and skill in which an individual or team competes against another or others for entertainment.

    "Physical skill", chess is not played physically, boxing is physical, soccer is played in the body also, chess is played in the brain(only)...

     

    YOU AREN'T READING THE DEFINITION CORRECTLY....

  • #1590

    You are still wrong on two counts. (1) "Physical exertion" AND "skill." It doesn't say specifically "physical skill"  (2) But even if you could prove that classification of a sport requires physical skill, listed above are plenty of videos showing you the physical skill involved in chess.  Bullet chess definitely requires "physical skill" I win most of my games in bullet because I am faster than my opponent, and typically they have played better "in their mind" than me.   Chess involves time, time involves speed, speed is physical.  

  • #1591

    video games need to be physical there is winning and losing there is also very competitive and you can make money ( youtube) so is it a sport if it is chess can be as well if it is not then chess is not  but I do think video games are a sport so chess is 

  • #1592

    Some argue all Esports are sports.    "Speedcubing," solving a rubix cube at high speeds is also considered a "sport" how can speedcubing be classified much differently than speed chess?  Honestly I don't see how changing the classification of a game into a sport makes it any more/less difficult or respectable in any way anyway happy.png  Some games are harder than sports, some sports are a joke (i.e. "Crab racing"), but a lot of people in this thread attempt to devalue or undermine the legitimacy of chess by saying it shouldn't be a sport.  Are mental competitions less beneficial for the human race than physical ones?  I would argue the contrary.  This aside... Chess is still under the "sport" category in a slightly tricky way.  

  • #1593

    Some sports are a joke, e.g. American Foootball.

  • #1594
    AntonioEsfandiari wrote:

    You are still wrong on two counts. (1) "Physical exertion" AND "skill." It doesn't say specifically "physical skill"   

    I asked two people, an aerospace engineer, and an English professor at a community college...

    I didn't mention chess(is it a sport) or this forum conversation, I just asked how is the sentence read in the definition...


    To qualify as a sport, an activity first has to have a physical skill involved...  

    Not a physical activity/movement(alone), a physical skill is required

     

    To make sure we are 100% clear here, a physical skill that is brought into existence through a human body,

    Chess is a game, and that game is not played in the physical body the way a sport is...

    Anyone that has followed this conversation for the last few days, who is saying anything else will have to be chalked up as being dumb as a rock at this point...

     

  • #1595

    Is @BudKingBud still arguing against everyone because it seams so especially with the "dumb as a rock" insult...  OR is this an equal debate with long posts?  Im confused

  • #1596

    https://www.fide.com/fide/fide-world-chess-federation.html  117 countries recognize chess as a sport.   Just because the physical effort in chess is minimal does not mean it is non-existent.   The faster chess you play, the more physical skill required, the slower you play, it is lessened.  It is all on a spectrum.  For example, 1 minute chess is quite physical, especially with a real board and pieces, 10 second chess is EXTREMELY physical, even as an e-sport, you have to fine tune "motor skills" to get the pieces on the right squares, premove rapidly, etc.  
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=miRioF6OV98&t=17s See how fast they are moving the pieces?  Try and argue that is not physical exertion and/or fine motor skills.  
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2AMN9tHSB0 this requires a lot more proficiency in mouse skills than 99% of esports.  
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bzrap8Vtyq8 Do you have the physical skill required to move the pieces to the right squares this fast? 
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ftTsnsNXUGc
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StnAGJDBjfo  More chess "athletes" 
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sb9zFH9w8bI starts at 1:30, can you move this fast and accurately?
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AaZuoQAbu2E aspiring young athletes

  • #1597

    Antonio, if you want to argue that blitz, speed chess, or "fast chess" is a sport, I understand what you are saying, I have the whole time, I get your angle, but I will put it like this...
    The 2017 World blitz chess champion is Magnus Carlson...
    Here, check out his physical skill and mastery of piece movement in a game of speed chess!
    https://youtu.be/GL-uWmw4YMA?t=21s

  • #1598

    My response to Blockhead Bud.

    I don’t want to waste any more time with this pig ignorant individual. By the same token I don’t see why the mentally defective town drunk should be continually prominent on this thread. So once posted, I will occasionally copy and paste this to caution newcomers of this truly obnoxious individual. This I take on as a service to the chess.com community.

    He and many others argue that sport needs a physical component separate from the brain to be called ‘sport’. I am not unsympathetic to this viewpoint. However I believe a significant minority, including myself argue that chess is within our definition of sport. Numerous dictionaries include definitions of sport that don’t include vigorous movement. Blockhead Bud will not accept that there are certain words in English usage that can mean different things to different people.

    He continually misrepresents others points of view and accuses others of name calling while continually dishing it out himself. His contention that cerebral pursuits aren’t covered by dictionary definitions is a lie, and he knows it. At first, I admired his resoluteness, but after a while I realised I was dealing with a pig ignorant liar who is immune to reason.

  • #1599

    😤 

  • #1600
    AntonioEsfandiari wrote:

    @BKB You can do all the chess in your head all you want, but if you can't move the pieces to the right squares with proper motor function, then what good is it?  This is the same even for online chess, if you are constantly mis-clicking it will kill you.... The chess in your mind is no different than the calculating you do in every other sport. 

    The reason you are upset BKB is because your argument is actually that "most of the effort involved in successful chess is executed in the mind."   I can't argue with you there, clearly that is where 99% of the effort is,  but this doesn't take away from the technicality that chess is still classified as a sport.    The only physical requirement for chess to be classified as a sport is for it to require SOME amount of physical effort, and it clearly does.  

    P.S. Your brain is the most important part of success in any sport anyway.  We can also debate on this. 

    I agree with your passion, and I understand your frustration that chess is recognized as a sport.  When we think of sports we may think of high heart-rate, sweating, physical exhaustion.  But in a tricky way, just like a criminal lawyer getting his guilty client set free because of a loophole, chess is TECHNICALLY a sport.  

    I'm trying to understand your point of view. I think we all agree that the game of chess is played in a persons mind. But are you saying that a person must be able to move the pieces in order to play chess? Are you saying there must be a physical skill requirement to play chess?

    In your opinion did Stephen Hawking ever play chess? What about grandmasters who call out names of moves without ever touching or seeing a chess board? Is that not a game a chess? The definition of chess says that it's a board game, but is it required that a board be involved? For example, online chess is on a screen. No physical board. Or correspondence chess, where moves were mailed back and forth for many months. 

    I think it's the fact that chess is a mental game is why there are so many variations of how it's played. There not as many variations in something like baseball. The game of chess can be played outside, sitting down, between two players, with no board, no pieces, and no clock. The players may simply call out the moves. But I dont think baseball can be played outside without a field, balls, or bats. Because the physical skill part is missing, players and umpires calling out plays wouldnt work. Otherwise every player would just say they hit a home run.

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