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What is Caruana trying to prove?

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Krestez

I'm currently watching the Fide Grand Prix in Paris and Caruana is playing on after a terrible blunder. He had to give up queen for rook. Afterwards he willingly sacrificed his knight for little to no compensation. Why is he playing on in a position where he is almost a queen down? I think I could win that position against him without too much trouble. But he plays on against Nakamura?! It seems like a waste of time. I've never seen a GM do that!

Krestez

He just resigned.

Gugajrf

He was trying to get some counterplay that maybe could lead to a promotion from the a pawn or at least put Nakamura's Queen guarding the promotion square. Even maybe some perpetual checks but at GM level is very hard not to lose in that position.

I don't think he was doing that for bad reasons like waste time... He had legitimate hopes although hard to achieve them. But on the other hand how likely is it to blunder like that at GM level? Maybe Hikaru could make a mistake too...

Crazychessplaya

Eeez deesrespectfull.

VLaurenT

Those games count. Even from a purely psychological point of view, you don't resign early so as not to keep in the back of your mind the memory of an ultra-painful and quick loss ("this guy owns me").

Krestez
idreesarif wrote:

you should also keep in mind that this tournament is very very important for him ...... If he wins the tournament, he will finish 2nd in Grand Prix and qualifies for the next candidates ...........

Yea, but I don't see the point in playing on. Nakamura knows his stuff. When I saw Nb3 I was like WAT?? Nakamura was very shocked too. I thought Caruana was trolling.

Ron-Weasley
Krestez wrote:

I'm currently watching the Fide Grand Prix in Paris and Caruana is playing on after a terrible blunder. He had to give up queen for rook. Afterwards he willingly sacrificed his knight for little to no compensation. Why is he playing on in a position where he is almost a queen down? I think I could win that position against him without too much trouble. But he plays on against Nakamura?! It seems like a waste of time. I've never seen a GM do that!

Becasue the gam isn't over until checkmate. And because he's not a weak willed sissy. And at least if he doesn't win he might mentally exhaust his opponent so they lose thier next game. And becasue his opponent might get sick or indigestion and have to abandon the game. It's not over until its over.

ghostofmaroczy

It is my understanding that Nakamura and Caruana have disliked one another for a long time.  It has something to do with Caruana being born an American but playing for Italy.

Krestez
Ron-Weasley wrote:
Krestez wrote:

I'm currently watching the Fide Grand Prix in Paris and Caruana is playing on after a terrible blunder. He had to give up queen for rook. Afterwards he willingly sacrificed his knight for little to no compensation. Why is he playing on in a position where he is almost a queen down? I think I could win that position against him without too much trouble. But he plays on against Nakamura?! It seems like a waste of time. I've never seen a GM do that!

Becasue the gam isn't over until checkmate. And because he's not a weak willed sissy. And at least if he doesn't win he might mentally exhaust his opponent so they lose thier next game. And becasue his opponent might get sick or indigestion and have to abandon the game. It's not over until its over.

They're not old men playing in the park. They're super grandmasters. Who plays until checkmate lol? I find it silly to play on in such a bad position.

bean_Fischer

He thought Nakamura never won at that position. Well, he has the right to play on and you have the right to complain.

He might be bad in terms of showing it to us, non master. I don;t think I want to follow his footstep.

expand

Yes, the commentator, Sergei Tiviakov, said that it was very unprofessional for Caruana not to resign with such a horrible position.

macer75
ghostofmaroczy wrote:

It is my understanding that Nakamura and Caruana have disliked one another for a long time.  It has something to do with Caruana being born an American but playing for Italy.

Not that I have anything against Caruana, but now that you mention it, it is sort of weird that he's playing for Italy and not the US.

Ron-Weasley
Krestez wrote:

They're not old men playing in the park. They're super grandmasters. Who plays until checkmate lol? I find it silly to play on in such a bad position.

You take just the opposite position as I do. If it were a game in the park then its resignable. If its a professional game they should play to mate. You can't rule out the human factor. Indigestion could force your opponent into the toilet for the duration of the game. Why to corospondance playes play on for at least 4-5 months after they know the game is dead lost? Because their opponent minght die in the meantime and then they win on time. Just like corospondance players get a couple wins over their career from their opponents dieing otb players might win a couple over their career from their opponent keeling over or getting indigestion. Afterall you never know what they had for dinner last night, could have been some bad saurkraut and then you win or your opponent poops himself, and then he'll have the reputation that he's the "shittiest" player. lololol.

TitanCG

Maybe he was just rattled and couldn't resign.

PhoenixTTD

What is the link to watch the live coverage?  Is there an official site or just secondary sites?

edit:  I found it

ManlyLadyLumps
Ron-Weasley wrote:
Krestez wrote:

They're not old men playing in the park. They're super grandmasters. Who plays until checkmate lol? I find it silly to play on in such a bad position.

You take just the opposite position as I do. If it were a game in the park then its resignable. If its a professional game they should play to mate. You can't rule out the human factor. Indigestion could force your opponent into the toilet for the duration of the game. Why to corospondance playes play on for at least 4-5 months after they know the game is dead lost? Because their opponent minght die in the meantime and then they win on time. Just like corospondance players get a couple wins over their career from their opponents dieing otb players might win a couple over their career from their opponent keeling over or getting indigestion. Afterall you never know what they had for dinner last night, could have been some bad saurkraut and then you win or your opponent poops himself, and then he'll have the reputation that he's the "shittiest" player. lololol.

Disregarding the fact that playing on hoping your opponent will die in the mean time is horribly unprofessional, if not straight up immoral, you can't forget that these supergrandmasters have the technique to win with such slight advantages, i wouldn't be surprised if Nakamura could win against Houdini from the position blindfolded. Even if he gets horrible indigestion, it would either be called a no contest or he would win despite his condition because these guys are just that good

Ron-Weasley
ManlyLadyLumps wrote:

Disregarding the fact that playing on hoping your opponent will die in the mean time is horribly unprofessional, if not straight up immoral, you can't forget that these supergrandmasters have the technique to win with such slight advantages, i wouldn't be surprised if Nakamura could win against Houdini from the position blindfolded. Even if he gets horrible indigestion, it would either be called a no contest or he would win despite his condition because these guys are just that good

I doubt that anyone is hoping thier opponent will die. Its just playing to the fact that given that a corospondance game usually lasts 1 1/2 to 3 years that it's a real possibility. Corospondance GMs do win a few games that way, and when it's their time to go they lose a few that way. Its part of the natural order of things, not unethical at all, but fully expected.

TheKasparovOfChess

He had a right to carry on. If a position is hopelessly lost it shouldn't bother the winning player that the other person wants to carry on. If you know your stuff you can makes moves quickly, pile on the time pressure and the other, losing player should crumble. If you can't manage that then, well...the position wasn't so hopelessly lost to begin with.

rooperi

Can someone post the game, please?

rooperi

thanks