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Tactics Trainer Problem Difficulty


  • 8 weeks ago · Quote · #221

    TomHaegin

    I wonder too if any version 3 or whatever will ever arrive...

  • 5 weeks ago · Quote · #222

    Sceadungen

    At the same time as Santa Claus

  • 4 weeks ago · Quote · #223

    RobK44

    I'm stuck at 1200. Some people just click for checks, getting points and ruining it for me.

    rant over

  • 3 weeks ago · Quote · #224

    Sceadungen

    Tactics Trainer is becoming a real pain.

    It is almost impossible to progress, I have been up over 2000 now I struggle to get past 1700.

    a plus score of +1 is not uncommon for a correct solution 10 seconds or so over standard time, time penalties of -6 and 7 add to the difficulty of progressing.

    Problems of great complexity are now being rated  1600 or so.

    The result is that you are now endlessly seeing the same problems and overall the training experience is very demotivating.

    I would also suggest that you turn off the show timer function.

  • 9 days ago · Quote · #225

    benkku52

    I fully agree. With the current settings, it's almost impossible to leave the rating corridor one has been when these changes (see post #201) have been applied. Due to the lenghty phase with the "lower rated problems bug", I have dropped to a slot between 1500 and 1600 where I've now been floating for about a year.

    Luckily, in the recent past there have been added a lot of new problems at least.

    But the main issue remains unsolved and will be until the much-awaited and long-ago-promised version 3 will arrive (will it ever?), and it is indeed frustrating. The point is that you can't improve your rating by trying to solve every problem slowly and thoroughly (as soon as you take only a bit too much time over the average, you're just being punished with negative points), and trying to get over it fast and catching a few extra points by rapidly solving the stuff that looks so familiar results in a lot of errors, which again affects your rating negatively.

    I'd really like to see a reliable announcement about when this V3 will actually become true.

  • 9 days ago · Quote · #226

    chrka

    Of course you can improve your rating by trying to solve every problem carefully! In the process, you'll become more proficient at solving problems and your rating will go up. (This is what a rating should be, a measure of how good you are!) Solving problems for 15 minutes a day, I saw steady progress during the course of two years — and only when I actually took time to make sure I saw the entire line did I improve. Sure, going from 1200 to mid-1900s in two years is not that spectacular, but tactics is not my forte exactly. Which is kind of my point =) 

    (But that lower rated problem bug is really frustrating, though. I've had problems after switching between TT here and on my phone. Resetting TT seems to fix the problems though, at least for a while)

  • 8 days ago · Quote · #227

    TomHaegin

    TT's behaviour is in some ways just strange and illogical.

    E.g. in a 4 move puzzle, you may get the first 3 moves right but miss the last one, you may still get points even though you did not solve the full problem. I think this is not useful.

    Likewise it makes me laugh when I lose more points on a problem I have solved correctly but too slow, than i gain points when I solve a problem still in time (say 65%).

    For slowness (more than double the avg. time) you should just receive zero points, and for not solving the full problem you should always lose some points.

  • 8 days ago · Quote · #228

    chrka

    TomHaegin wrote:

    TT's behaviour is in some ways just strange and illogical.

    E.g. in a 4 move puzzle, you may get the first 3 moves right but miss the last one, you may still get points even though you did not solve the full problem. I think this is not useful.

    Likewise it makes me laugh when I lose more points on a problem I have solved correctly but too slow, than i gain points when I solve a problem still in time (say 65%).

    For slowness (more than double the avg. time) you should just receive zero points, and for not solving the full problem you should always lose some points.

    But it's not a score, it's a rating! Wouldn't you agree that it's likely that a problem that you solve quickly is easier to you than one that takes you longer?

    Now, let's say you can solve 100% of the problems rated 1200 within the average time, 100% of the problems rated 1300 within twice the average time, 100% of the problems rated 2000 in 256 times the average time &c. (Of course, the numbers are arbitrary). Now, if you began with a rating of 2000, you would stay on 2000 but you might spend a day or two on every problem. Doesn't it make more sense to lower your rating so that TT can give you problems that are suited to your level? And would you say that a rating of 2000 accurately describes your problem-solving capability?

    (Of course, this is example is a bit contrived, but it does illustrate the problem.)

    Instead, you could focus on your accuracy (number of correctly solved problems vs. total number of problems attempted). Then, the number of problems you've solved is more of a score than a rating.

    The problem of what to do with partially solved problems is more complex. Also, what to do when you see/guess the first move and then need to keep on solving the problem? (I know that another site uses a system where you get penalized for taking a long time after the first move(s). Something like that might be useful here as well.)

  • 8 days ago · Quote · #229

    Josimar73

    I agree somehow with Chrka. However the tactics trainer doesn't support an in my opinion proper thought process. In my rating area (1600) there are e.g. many short problems asking you to sacrifice the queen for a mate in two or three (to give an example) which require a total solving time below 10-20s. There is no time to verify the line and one should be allowed to consider a sacrifice even if you know the pattern because sometimes there is a piece in the way and you need to verify that. I would opt for a reasonable time slot somewhere between 2 and 3 minutes without any punishment for correct solutions. This would support a proper thought process and would be in the range of standard tournament times. Problems which are to hard for me take me much longer than the proposed time.

  • 8 days ago · Quote · #230

    dokter_nee

    I think the rating system is fine/normal now. To be a good tactics also means to be able to see quickly tactics, so I think it's acceptable to lose points when you are too slow (I'm slow myself). Besides the rating should only be secondary. Tactics trainer is meant to train tactics, and that it does well. Only thing that is really annoying is this bug that I regularly get, which is after I made a correct move, suddenly I can't play any more moves with the pieces of the colour I was playing, and it also flips to the beginning set-up. So than I have to move the other colour, and it of course says incorrect, after which I get some strange error page, and if I want to go back in my browser to the tactic I was playing, I will get a different tactic, and after solving that one, I'll get flipped back to the original tactic? This particular bug happens like once every 40/50 tactics or so. Very annoying!

  • 8 days ago · Quote · #231

    benkku52

    Please reread post #201 in this thread where a staff member promised some reasonable improvements, including no more negative points for correct solutions regardless of the time used.

    It's more a question of why they have to wait for the mysterious version 3 to be fully functional before implementing these changes into tactics trainer.

  • 8 days ago · Quote · #232

    Jion_Wansu

    My chess mentor rating is at 1600+ but chess mentor is showing me how each piece moves. why not tactics anymore?

  • 8 days ago · Quote · #233

    Josimar73

    @dokter_nee: it is possible that the tactics trainer is ok for you but I think we can agree that the individual performance increases with thinking time. So, if you are interested in blitz this is ok. I'm interested in standard time otb (2 hrs each per 40 moves + 1hr) which means that I should use 3 minutes per move as an average. I don't want to get punished when I have to evaluate the position after I gave a king queen fork if there is a better move than taking the queen and often there is a mate in two.

    Chesstempo has two modes for blitz and standard which means only a second table and a button to choose. Which makes sense because those are two different disciplines in chess.

  • 8 days ago · Quote · #234

    Benedictine

    I agree that Tactics Trainer does not encourage a healthy chess thought process if you are interested in standard chess. I have since switched to chesstempo, I'm particularly pleased with the mixed mode there which offers a balance of realistic positions, attack and defensive, and the timing system there offers me a realisitc time frame reflecting the time I could spend on a move OTB. This is because you have between 5-10 minutes per move before you start losing ratings. Also the quality of the games are high. Switching over is a no brainer for me.

  • 7 days ago · Quote · #235

    Sceadungen

    thank you for taking the time to comment.

    I did also mention cutting out the "show timer" this gives assistance to solvers in regard to the complexity of the problem they are solving.They would not have this in real life situations at the board, for myself I never use it

    Also more importantly I think it is being abused. Problems of high complexity are now featuring in a very low rating window, in my opinion these are well beyond the capacity of inexperienced players.

    The common denominator in them is a long solving time  shown on the timer, sufficient for an engine to be set up and used to solve the problem.

    I find TT a useful tool in my chess development, my comments in this post are to improve a good tool further.

  • 7 days ago · Quote · #236

    alexm2310

    Am I the only person who found it much, much harder to progress from 1700 to 1800 in TT than any other rating gap? Something about those ~1750 puzzles just screwed with me, somehow, lol.

  • 36 hours ago · Quote · #237

    Sceadungen

    I seem to be having trouble using Google Chrome Browser

    The problem resets as soon as I make a move the clock continues to run but the trainer is then uresponsive.

    Oh and by the way in case I forgot to mention it before deducting points for correct solutions is demotivating and unfair.

  • 35 hours ago · Quote · #238

    alexm2310

    Not sure if anyone else has had this problem, but there's one specific puzzle rated around 2150 I think, and every time I come across it, I am unable to complete the puzzle. I make the first move, "correct", the opponent moves, and then I am unable to move any piece and finish the puzzle. I've seen it 3 times now, but can't remember the puzzle ID

  • 35 hours ago · Quote · #239

    JWestlake

    alexm2310 schreef:

    Not sure if anyone else has had this problem, but there's one specific puzzle rated around 2150 I think, and every time I come across it, I am unable to complete the puzzle. I make the first move, "correct", the opponent moves, and then I am unable to move any piece and finish the puzzle. I've seen it 3 times now, but can't remember the puzzle ID

    I've also seen this puzzle several times.

  • 35 hours ago · Quote · #240

    alexm2310

    JWestlake wrote:
    alexm2310 schreef:

    Not sure if anyone else has had this problem, but there's one specific puzzle rated around 2150 I think, and every time I come across it, I am unable to complete the puzzle. I make the first move, "correct", the opponent moves, and then I am unable to move any piece and finish the puzzle. I've seen it 3 times now, but can't remember the puzzle ID

    I've also seen this puzzle several times.

    Does it involve trading rooks then queen forking the rook and king, only for the puzzle to freeze after the queen move?


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