Forums

Using the "Explore" link DURING a turn-based game?!

Sort:
JohnnySpin

Hello all!

I have been a proud member of Chess.com now for a number of years and have played in a number of turn-based tourney's etc...and really enjoy myself, and at times chatting with the people that I'm playing, from all over the world, which I find very cool!Tongue Out

On the screen of all of these games are various tabs and links that we all use to play our games --- analysis, notes, conditional moves, etc...

However, there is one link that is available that I have been aware of for years now, and have just asssumed that it is/was never to be used DURING ANY PART of ANY game in progress...the "Explore" link!

Having said this, a couple of thoughts literally just occured to me today that concern me...

First, Why would a link be available DURING a chess game that explicitly gives exact positional move options based on your exact position and move number, and the stats of those particular moves with a single click of that link??!!

I have always just assumed that this is/was NOT legal to do again, DURING play. Am I wrong?! Otherwise, why is it there?

Yet I have to be wrong, right?! I have NEVER, EVER used it DURING play!

But, IT'S THERE! And my opponents, I say, may unwittingly, and possibly quite innocently may, and probably HAVE used this link DURING play, again, because it IS available! LOL

I would just like to know, on the record, if it IS in fact illegal to use during play, then WHY is it THERE? ( ie. and not pop-up AFTER the game is over?) 

AND, I can't imagine that it's possible that I am wrong on this, (although I have been wrong about a few things in life. LOL Wink) CAN it be used during play? (NO! LOL) And if not, how do I know that my opponents aren't just using it during our games to decide on their next move???

Again, since it IS available! YellSurprisedLaughing

Someone please set me straight as to how this is please.

Chess.com rocks! And so do all of you, my fellow chess players!

Peace and love be with you all!

-BrootFaus Cool

samtoyousir

It's legal to use in turn-based, but not in live.

samtoyousir

https://support.chess.com/customer/portal/articles/1444879-cheaters-cheating-what-you-need-to-know

samtoyousir

http://www.chess.com/forum/view/general/game-explorer-and-cheating

kleelof

There is also another lovely link there called Analysis. This can help a lot in learning how to formulate your tactics.

cdowis75

Correspondence chess should be a tool to help prepare for live chess -- openings, analysis, etc.

mrlucky64

sick of the book moves...try 960, no explore!!

http://www.chess.com/tournament/960-crown-classic-2

Ubik42
mrlucky64 wrote:

sick of the book moves...try 960, no explore!!

http://www.chess.com/tournament/960-crown-classic-2

I still want explore just in case my 960 game ever randomly gives me classic.

baddogno

Correspondence chess ("online" in Erikspeak) has always allowed the use of research materials for games.  The running joke way back when people used postcards to send their moves was that the player with the largest chess library wins.  Today's databases are simply the digital equivalent of a very large library.  If you can play a game without access to a database all the better for you; lots of folks prefer that as it more nearly resembles OTB.  Lots of others prefer to use it as "training wheels" chess and actively research their openings in the hope that at least some of it may stick.  It's all good.  If you strongly believe that even correspondence players shouldn't use anything other than their brains to play, there used to be a group dedicated to just that.  They're probably still around.

kleelof

"I too have explored the game page somewhat and was surprised to see the explore link. However, I never used it because it would alter my own game and at the end of the game, I would have wasted my time playing the "explorer's" game, rather than my own."

I believe the move explorer is realy only useful during openings, isn't it?

baddogno

@kleelof: Not really, premium members have access to a database of master games that allows you to get deep into a middle game before the actual chess game starts.  At a certain point someone deviates from"book" and you have to play.  Sometimes this can be pretty late in the game, hence my term "training wheels chess".  It's also why "online" ratings have as much to do with your research skills as chess and mean so little.  Still, you have to start somewhere...

kleelof

When I play Online Chess, I use databases for openings for the first 5 - 8 moves. After that, I go to Youtube and a few other places and spend a little time studying about the basics for the opening.

This has helped my Live games because now I know some basic responses to a many popular openings as well as some of the theory behind them.

This really helps with strategy when I get into the middle games.

I think baddogno's phrase "training wheels chess" is an accurate enough description for it. Just like playing guitar or a musical instrument, you progress more solidly when you can take your time to go slowly and let the basics sink in.

Irontiger
LongIslandMark wrote:
baddogno wrote:

@kleelof: Not really, premium members have access to a database of master games that allows you to get deep into a middle game before the actual chess game starts.  At a certain point someone deviates from"book" and you have to play.  Sometimes this can be pretty late in the game, hence my term "training wheels chess".  It's also why "online" ratings have as much to do with your research skills as chess and mean so little.  Still, you have to start somewhere...

1. There are other free open game databases on the internet, so people who are not premium members should not feel at a disadvange.

2. It can be "training wheels" chess - but blindly following the most popular move doesn't really help you in the end if you have no real understanding of the purpose of the moves.

3. Online ratings, in my experience, have more to do with how much time you put into a move. If you can spend an hour or so when needed, you can hold your own against a better player that is only spending a few minutes on a move.

Hear, hear !

 

(3. is the only reason I have a 2-0 score against titled players on this site)

BadHabitZZZ

I use it to learn and understand the middle game positions that arise from openings that I intend to play,..

But taking it serious is a mistake,...

BadHabitZZZ

p.s.  Thanx for the tip,..

I never noticed it or used it

will have to try it immediately  Tongue Out

Jmb27

I think that the explorer is a good tool for being able to view games that masters have played from a similar opening position, not so much for which higher percentage move white or black should play.

JohnnySpin

Wow! I really appreciate the comments that ALL OF YOU have made!

I was really surprised that it IS an available AND legal tool. I too, as some have mentioned, have rarely seen anyone just smash me as a result of their great play/my poor play, and/or most of the time, a combo of both. LOL Yell But also a potential edge in using the explore link in a game, save a few that seemed a bit shady. But no accusations here. Laughing

Love the links provided by some of you too! I use the analysis window all the time to calculate different lines and never saw anything wrong with that.

In the end, I'm OK with the exploration link and will probably NOW use it as a tool - but not a crutch, because apparently, it's OK, AND available to BOTH players in a game AND does help in becoming better at chess.

You have ALL been very generous and kind with your comments, opinions, and suggestions, and I greatly appreciate that! Laughing

This is one of the main reasons why I love Chess.com so much -- the comradery here is unparalleled!

Thanks again to EVERY ONE OF YOU! Laughing

Peace and love to you all!

-BrootFaus Wink

MrDamonSmith

Yes, it's legal & eccepted in correspondence chess (it's called online chess on here, can someone tell me why?) & has been used forever. I never used it until recently in one game because I decided to start trying to learn some openings. Both me & my opponent were following a Topalov game for 18 moves!! & I was playing black in a Slav & based on the Topalov game (Topalov was white & won) I was heading down the road to a loss & knew it because I was deliberately following a game where his opponent lost. BUT..... we were heading for a position that I thought gave me an attacking advantage IF my opponent took a pawn that seemed free. Topalov didn't take it but my opponent did. My opponent lost very quickly after he took. 

I think research like that can help a player develop their skills & become stronger.

baddogno

You can get into some funny situations in correspondence chess.  A couple of years ago my opponent trotted out the Najdorf and I played an aggressive bishop move that landed us in the poisoned pawn variation.  At our level, neither of us should have been playing such a sophisticated and heavily analyzed line, but there we were.  At a certain point my opponent ran out of book and played something that seemed a bit dubious.  I had been doing a Chess Mentor course on the Sicilian and one of the lessons dealt with the position.  The author wrote something like "Yes black prevents "whatever" with this move but at terrible cost".  Where, where, what, don't leave me hanging.  It took me almost 2 hours to figure out what the author was talking about but it led to an easily winning position.  Of course you could say that I was realy only playing chess for those 2 hours and even then I had a heck of a hint.  That's a criticism I'll gladly accept, but I did at least learn to stay away from the poisoned pawn Najdorf. Laughing

cdowis75

I find Explorer very useful

1. avoid obvious blunders in opening lines with which I am unfamiliar

2. It gives a full listing of games with the same position, and useful to look at themes and patterns.  "Why did he make that move, and how did it affect the middle game" beyond the opening itself.