Note: Currently autoclaim kicks in even if the remaining opponent is already in 2nd place (and there is no eliminated player to protect).
This will be changed soon.
Claim Win, Autoclaim and Autoresign
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Thinking about it... I wonder if it would be good if autoclaim did NOT kick in when the second place player resigned or timed out. IOW it would only work if he had been checkmated.
Otherwise, just thinking wildly here, I can see a possibility for a second place player to calculate the scores, resign, and have first place forced into autoclaim before third place can take second place's king.
Or did I miss something?
I don't understand what you are saying. maybe make an example?
Red is in first place
Yellow is in second but is in a bad posiiton
Green is eliminated
Blue has a great position against yellow, poised to take queen and some pieces and then checkmate
So yellow resigns, and Red has autoclaim kick in. Yellow gets second even tho Blue as about to pound him down to third.
Say there is not autoclaim, isn't Yellow's best move to resign anyway and hope Red claims immediatly?
Also, Red has to be ahead of Blue by a ton as there is a resigned King on the board.
(So Yellow should resign in a way that makes sure Red will get his King.)
Not sure autoclaim really changes much, other than presicely what it's meant to do, namely prevent Red from gifting points to Blue. If Yellow is ahead of Blue by more than 20 points at that stage of the game then he probably deserves 2nd.
i dont agree with autoclaim, if u give points to third player and second reports u, u must be banned or something, but force everybody to autoclaim win is unfair
We have changed it now so Autoclaim will no longer happen when the remainig opponent is in 2nd place.
What's the problem? You can still claim!
Before you were forced to claim. Now you have the option of playing on a bit, for fun, or for getting more points for the point chase leaderboards (that will be released in a future update).
I read the original post, and, I understand the reasons and motivations for implementing the "autoclaim" feature.
https://www.chess.com/4-player-chess?g=1260051
However, (1) I did not see a "Claim Win" button, my attention is not always on every part of my screen, let alone the bottom corner, or all of the other player's points, and (2) At the time the game terminated, and "autoclaim" message was displayed in chat, I was thinking that I could win by check-mate, an additional 20-points.
After reviewing things, I realized that I'd lost 20 points by not paying attention to specific scores, and the ability to claim a win. Instead, the 3rd place player received 20 points.
As stated, did not affect overall standing, but, in terms of Ratings points (gained or lost), does it matter then?
If assigning 20 points to a competitor coming in 3rd place won't change overall ranking, then, I'm assuming (I don't know) that no matter the points outcome, ratings would not have been negatively affected.
Did I receive the same ratings adjustment as I would have if I would have check-mated and received the 20-points, lost to the 3rd place player with the "autoclaim" feature?
What about the fact that my opponent still had a pawn, and I could have blundered and lost the game, or not given-up any further points? (Not likely, but possible.) Then it makes sense that the 20-points should be assigned to the remaining opponent.
Suggestion:
Make the "autoclaim" button more prominent. Maybe even prompt: "Are you sure you want to continue playing? You can autoclaim win on points."
If autoclaiming is rejected, then offer the points to the other player to terminate the match. Same outcome. (No difference in potential ratings adjustment.)
It's so simple, I don't get what all your elaborating is about. if you will still win even if you resign, the resign button gets a new name - that's it.
autoclaim is automatic, there is no "rejecting" it. In the game you linked, autoclaim kicked in to make sure yellow gets 2nd (prevents you from gifting 2nd place to green)
spacebar wrote:
Claiming the Win
When there are only 2 players left, and one player is ahead by 41 points (21 points for =1ptQ games), then that player will win even if he resigns.
In this case the resign button is renamed to "Claim Win".
Example:
Red has 100 points, Blue 55, Yellow (eliminated) 10, Green (eliminated) 5.
-> Red will see a "Claim Win" button rather than a "Resign" button, as he will win even if he resigns.
(Note that points do not affect ratings changes, only final placement does)
Autoclaim
In some cases a player will be forced to claim the win, that is to say the server will press the claim win button for him. This happens when there is an eliminated player in 2nd place who is at least 41 (or 21) points ahead of 3rd. This will prevent the winner from gifting points to the remaining opponent in 3rd to overtake the eliminated player in 2nd. Autoclaim protects eliminated players in 2nd place.
Autoclaim only happens when claiming does not change the standings!
Examples:
Red has 100 points, Blue 55 (eliminated), Yellow 10, Green (eliminated) 5.
-> The server will autoclaim the win for Red to ensure that Blue gets 2nd place. Autoclaim prevents Red from gifting points to Yellow to overtake Blue.
Red has 100 points, Blue 55 (eliminated), Yellow 40, Green (eliminated) 5.
-> Red can claim the win, but the server will not autoclaim the win for Red because Yellow will overtake Blue even if Red claims immediately. Note that Yellow is not guaranteed second however, because Red could checkmate Yellow (or Yellow might resign) before overtaking Blue.
For FFA only
Here is an example where I think Autoclaim shouldnt happen but did https://www.chess.com/4-player-chess?g=1632782
At the end of the game, blue is in 3rd, but should have had every right to have a chance to finish 2nd.
Red played actively and accumulated 33 points.
Blue fell too far behind on points, which he could have easily avoided.
mattedmonds escribió:
Here is an example where I think Autoclaim shouldnt happen but did https://www.chess.com/4-player-chess?g=1632782
At the end of the game, blue is in 3rd, but should have had every right to have a chance to finish 2nd.
Interesting example because if blue had noticed about autoclaim he would have sacrificed his qeen to get a pawn and get same points than red, would autoclaim proclamed in this situation?
manuelgzma wrote:
mattedmonds escribió:
Here is an example where I think Autoclaim shouldnt happen but did https://www.chess.com/4-player-chess?g=1632782
At the end of the game, blue is in 3rd, but should have had every right to have a chance to finish 2nd.
Interesting example because if blue had noticed about autoclaim he would have sacrificed his qeen to get a pawn and get same points than red, would autoclaim proclamed in this situation?
Yes you are right, with the way autoclaim works, their best move here is sacrificing their Q to have a chance at 2nd place.
autoclaim only if standing remain unchanged. if two were tied and are not anymore, or vice versa, there should be no autoclaim i think.
you can test on the analysisi board, the resign flag (to the right of >> >| ) will change to a cup for claim and a checkmark for autoclaim
YeJunChi 写道:
Please don't advertise your position everywhere. I suggest you create a separate thread about it.
Claiming the Win
When there are only 2 players left and the player with the most points is ahead of his opponent by 21 points or more (41 points for "+40"-games), then that player will win even if he resigns.
In this case the resign button is renamed to "Claim Win".
Example:
Red has 100 points, Blue 55, Yellow (eliminated) 10, Green (eliminated) 5.
-> Red will see a "Claim Win" button rather than a "Resign" button, as he will win even if he resigns.
(Note that points do not affect ratings changes, only final placement does)
Autoclaim
In some cases a player will be forced to claim the win, that is to say the server will press the claim win button for him. This happens when there is an eliminated player in 2nd place who is at least 20 (or 40) points ahead of 3rd. This prevents the winner from gifting points to the remaining opponent in 3rd to overtake the eliminated player in 2nd. Autoclaim protects eliminated players in 2nd place.
Examples:
Red has 100 points, Blue 55 (eliminated), Yellow 10, Green (eliminated) 5.
-> The server will autoclaim the win for Red to ensure that Blue gets 2nd place. Autoclaim prevents Red from gifting points to Yellow to overtake Blue.
Red has 100 points, Blue 55 (eliminated), Yellow 40, Green (eliminated) 5.
-> Red can claim the win, but the server will not autoclaim the win for Red because Yellow will overtake Blue even if Red claims immediately. Note that Yellow is not guaranteed second however, because Red could checkmate Yellow (or Yellow might resign) before overtaking Blue.
Hint: In analysis/replay mode, the resign button (flag icon) will indicate Claim win or Autoclaim by changing the icon to a cup or checkmark:
Autoresign
For Solo games only: If there are only two players left, and one of them cannot win (there aren’t enough points left to be made to reach 1st), the he is forced to resign. This prevents “king making” (deciding the winner) by a player who cannot win himself.