The difference is people weren't complaining until things were changed. Now noone plays and noone agrees how to fix the mess!
What was wrong with Old Standard?
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@daveborn Did you take a look at all the 15 more balanced positions? Great possibilities and a lot of fun with a more balanced position. Do you enjoy a 5-0 win for red/yellow in teams in world championship match games with old standard?
May 2, 2022
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#4
RobustMaple wrote:
@daveborn Did you take a look at all the 15 more balanced positions? Great possibilities and a lot of fun with a more balanced position. Do you enjoy a 5-0 win for red/yellow in teams in world championship match games with old standard?
You clearly haven't watched any of the world championship teams matches lmao
@Radon I’m not talking about the final, but many matches before the final. Maybe your the one who didn’t looked too many tournament game in all those years. Lmao?
May 2, 2022
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#6
RobustMaple wrote:
@Radon I’m not talking about the final, but many matches before the final. Maybe your the one who didn’t looked too many tournament game in all those years. Lmao?
I commentated the championships with Luke 
Cool, but I don’t remember seeing you commentating in the first few years in teams.
May 2, 2022
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#8
RobustMaple wrote:
Cool, but I don’t remember seeing you commentating in the first few years in teams.
Surely that trend shows that as people learned how to play BG properly it became less one sided? Yes I didn't start playing the game until Jan 2021 so no surprise there.
May 2, 2022
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#9
RobustMaple wrote:
Cool, but I don’t remember seeing you commentating in the first few years in teams.
Nope. But I did, and I can back Radon up.
If you'd watched the championships with the old standard setup, you would remember that the two best teams in the world played 9 consecutive matches where blue and green won.
I lost a lot of minutes to caculate all wins from the games played in the last world championship in teams. I admit, the last one was far less worst than I tough and no 5-0 r/y wins in this one (I didn't calculate round 1) as I used the games available on challonge.com + the final.
Results : 57 games played. 32 wins for red/yellow. 25 wins for blue/green.
Wins R/Y : 56,1%
Wins B/G : 43,9%
But I still think it's unbalanced and we should not come back to the old standard.
May 2, 2022
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#11
What was wrong with Old Standard?
Old Standard for TEAM was fine, Both opposite players must unite their strength to the fullest and be highly efficient in every move as a team. Old Std no problem in TEAM.
Old Standard for FFA highly unbalanced for green pieces, There are many reports, there are also many comments from the best players that say so, the engines also indicate it.
And well, in my personal opinion, I also confirm it, since in FFA it is where I have played the most and as a spectator I have also witnessed it live.
On many occasions, when blue lets its green opposite die, players with green pieces fail to resist beyond move number 8.
To deny this would be to be inconsequent and a liar, we cannot fool ourselves, we have discussed this a thousand times.
In the last survey that was carried out, it also showed that not everyone wants to return to Old Standard. The people who expressed themselves in the voting are people who represent the 4pc very well, and they are people who actively participate in the discussion forums. These people are very valuable to the administration, there were the best TEAM and FFA players who voted.
I have approached you to respond in a kind and respectful way, since what you mention is of my total interest.
I would have liked more people to participate? Of course, yes, but we cannot force them.
Greets cordially,
Martinaxo
May 2, 2022
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#12
martinaxo wrote:
What was wrong with Old Standard?
Old Standard for TEAM was fine, Both opposite players must unite their strength to the fullest and be highly efficient in every move as a team. Old Std no problem in TEAM.
Old Standard for FFA highly unbalanced for green pieces, There are many reports, there are also many comments from the best players that say so, the engines also indicate it.
And well, in my personal opinion, I also confirm it, since in FFA it is where I have played the most and as a spectator I have also witnessed it live.
On many occasions, when blue lets its green opposite die, players with green pieces fail to resist beyond move number 8.
To deny this would be to be inconsequent and a liar, we cannot fool ourselves, we have discussed this a thousand times.
In the last survey that was carried out, it also showed that not everyone wants to return to Old Standard. The people who expressed themselves in the voting are people who represent the 4pc very well, and they are people who actively participate in the discussion forums. These people are very valuable to the administration, there were the best TEAM and FFA players who voted.
I have approached you to respond in a kind and respectful way, since what you mention is of my total interest.
I would have liked more people to participate? Of course, yes, but we cannot force them.
Greets cordially,
Martinaxo
Martin, Omatamix is much worse for green than Old Standard, I also do not understand why you think top players all think green is the one in trouble because I for one do not think that applies. If blue doesnt help green in omatamix green is just dead within 4-5 moves period, that wasnt the case in old standard. Reports of people complaining about being "ganged up on" as green are just from weak players who do not understand how to defend properly. Yes RY have an advantage but it is minimal and in FFA far less important than an imbalance in Teams.
RobustMaple wrote:
I lost a lot of minutes to caculate all wins from the games played in the last world championship in teams. I admit, the last one was far less worst than I tough and no 5-0 r/y wins in this one (I didn't calculate round 1) as I used the games available on challonge.com + the final.
Results : 57 games played. 32 wins for red/yellow. 25 wins for blue/green.
Wins R/Y : 56,1%
Wins B/G : 43,9%
But I still think it's unbalanced and we should not come back to the old standard.
This is hardly much of an imbalance, not even that far from 2pc. Balance is not as important as whether or not the game is enjoyable to play!
@tommerrall949 Yes, I remember thank you! If you look at the games in the last final, can you honestly tell me that you think the most challenging lines were played by the runner-up (as red and yellow) in the last world championship? Icy could beat me a queen down and with closed eyes, yes I know. The match doesn't change the fact that there are others more balanced positions and I just think it's sad a lot of players are complaining of the changes, but didn't even look at those positions.
@martinaxo Good comment.
May 2, 2022
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#15
tommerrall949 wrote:
RobustMaple wrote:
Cool, but I don’t remember seeing you commentating in the first few years in teams.
Nope. But I did, and I can back Radon up.
If you'd watched the championships with the old standard setup, you would remember that the two best teams in the world played 9 consecutive matches where blue and green won.
correction, Tom, twelve.
fourplayerchess a écrit :
tommerrall949 wrote:
RobustMaple wrote:
Cool, but I don’t remember seeing you commentating in the first few years in teams.
Nope. But I did, and I can back Radon up.
If you'd watched the championships with the old standard setup, you would remember that the two best teams in the world played 9 consecutive matches where blue and green won.
correction, Tom, twelve.
Can we precise about who we are talking? It takes ages to look in the new archives, so I can hardly verified by myself since I don't have access to admin stats. If we talk about Valger/Barantsev or Icystun, it's clear those guys will win almost all matchs no matter the color 
. They were just so much better than everyone else at some point except maybe for the Wraku/Rezacz duo. I know, the last year Valger played against Icystun, they had a lot of blue/green wins in a row in the first match and in the first part of the final. But after that, mainly r/y wins. We can make the stats looks the way we want. I don't think anybody here really think blue/green have the same chances from the start. 2 supercomputer against each other it's probably 100% wins red and yellow.
ChessMasterGS a écrit :
Icystun and Martha played AGAINST Valger and Baranstev....
Yes, but one year Icy won in team with Valger. Last year Valger didn't played. Were you answering to my question? I hope Luke or Tom will precise what they think.
Martin, Omatamix is much worse for green than Old Standard, I also do not understand why you think top players all think green is the one in trouble because I for one do not think that applies. If blue doesnt help green in omatamix green is just dead within 4-5 moves period, that wasnt the case in old standard. Reports of people complaining about being "ganged up on" as green are just from weak players who do not understand how to defend properly. Yes RY have an advantage but it is minimal and in FFA far less important than an imbalance in Teams.
If you are "ganged up on" early and your opposite does not help you will have troubles with any color in any setup. Green of course has the worst cards. But I don't think old Standard is better than Omatamix in this scenario. I just think you have played it more often and know more defensive ideas.
I really don't know which one is better in teams, because I basically have no idea about teams, so my opinion does not count much when it comes to teams. But when it comes to FFA/Solo I am one of the most experienced players, and I have the feeling Omatamix is much more balanced, more enjoyable and has more diversity in openings. And a lot of top players, especially the OGs agree with me on that.
One of the few big players who does not agree is @Radon, and you can't really count him since he does not play anymore.
What was wrong with Old Standard that admins felt the need to change? Who cares if it's imbalanced since each game you get a different color and it evens out over time. Furthermore people liked it and were used to it and I didn't read a lot of complaints about old 4pc!