There are several good lines, but not ones where you get a better position unless white makes a mistake. What is your 1d4 defence ? If you play the KID or Dutch you can try these. If you are an 1e4 man, then 1c4 e5 is a good reply...
English Opening
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Symmetrical keeps you about even if you break at the right time.
Maybe look at Beating Unusual Openings by Richard Palliser (2006).
https://web.archive.org/web/20140627072813/http://www.chesscafe.com/text/hansen107.pdf
RasputinTheMad wrote:
Even 1...e5 often goes into a nice Leningrad Dutch after 2...f5.
I spent some time looking at 1c4 f5...(I'm directing a theme tourney at the moment as I want to learn more...)
There are some interesting transpostions and thinking. I'm mostly interested in it from the white perspective. Questions arise: 1/ Does white allow e5 ? 2/ Fianchetto the LSB at once or after Nf3 ? 3/How does black playing an early d6 affect move orders ? etc
One conclusion I came to is that the "d4" mainlines are better than the "English" systems against the Dutch. By English systems, I mean the Botvinnik as promoted by Tony Kosten for example.
Ram565656 wrote:
Every time Someone plays C4 against me, I get into a worse position and don't know what to do. Can anyone please tell me the best lines against the English opening where I get an equal or slightly better position.
@Ram, copy him exactly for the first 5-10 moves
RasputinTheMad wrote:
The main problem with 1.c4 f5 is that White can go 2.d4 and now Black has to fight for his e5 push. No advantage over main lines there (except to avoid some anti-Dutch variations).
The other problem with 1.c4 f5 is that if Black was intending a Stonewall, White can go 2.d3 and now the e2-e4 push is deadly.
I've played 1c4 for about 2.5 years now and haven't faced the Dutch as often as I thought I would. Many years ago I played the Dutch against 1d4/1Nf3/1c4 with good results. I think people may not be playing the Dutch against 1d4 now because there are some good Anti Dutch lines - specifically 2Bg5. If they drop the Dutch for 1d4 because of this then they may regard the work to play against flank opening as a "luxury" and so don't use against 1c4 etc
With regard to the point about 2d3 with a coming e4 being good against a Stonewall setup , how do you see white playing against a cagey black player who plays e6 with a possible Classical Dutch as well as Stonewall setup ?Also after 1d4 f5 2d3, what's wrong with 2...e5 ?
but perhaps your first paragraph point is the most important about the mainlines. Never the less there are many slightly different opening orders that can make the opening play interesting. I spent a few hours studying this a couple of months ago and was surprised at how the play could swing from one player to the other.
Since the English opening is like white version Sicilian Dragon, you can copy the Yugoslov attack.
Dec 15, 2015
0
#9
@RAM565656
Palliser recommends the symmetrical. I know that in the old book "How to Open a Chess Game" Lajos Portisch recommends the Symmetrical English for people learning the game. Also, Nigel Povah wrote a book on the English Opening that got some good reviews. Unfortunately its an old book and will be hard to find, but it will provide a good survey of various ways for black to play against it.
marknatm wrote:
... in the old book "How to Open a Chess Game" Lajos Portisch recommends the Symmetrical English for people learning the game. ...
Do you have that book handy? If so, maybe you can help resolve something for us. I understand that it was in there that the thing about a playable middlegame was stated. I was wondering about the context - in particular, whether or not there was some indication of an intention to specify something one SHOULD do or just to suggest a possible approach that one MIGHT choose to try.
You could play a Closed Sicilian in reverse. It's a straightforward opening based more on ideas than specific lines.
You could also use it as White if you play 1.e4.
Just play c6 and d5 or e6 and d5, intending a Slav or QGD. There are a few extra options for white, but none of them to be scared of.
Every time Someone plays C4 against me, I get into a worse position and don't know what to do. Can anyone please tell me the best lines against the English opening where I get an equal or slightly better position.