Hate playing against the najdorf or modern dragon?

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Avatar of erikido23

An example line of 7. d5. 

Avatar of erikido23
BigTy wrote:

Isn't the chelyabinsk the name of one of the mainline sveshnikov variations?


 Nope(unless the mainline is different than I thought it was)...It is a structure which can come about from many different opening systems.

Avatar of SukerPuncher333

I'm not sure if you can force a maroczy with 5. Bd3 (for the same reason why 5. f3 also can't force it). True, you managed to leave the c-pawn unblocked, but you also need more control of d5. Black can respond like this:

Avatar of erikido23
SukerPuncher333 wrote:

I'm not sure if you can force a maroczy with 5. Bd3 (for the same reason why 5. f3 also can't force it). True, you managed to leave the c-pawn unblocked, but you also need more control of d5. Black can respond like this:

 


 6.  n-f3 and 7c4 reaches a good variation of the kalashnikov for white according to soltis

Avatar of SukerPuncher333

I'm not sure how that would transpose to the Kalashnikov (maybe you could post the line leading to it).

Even after 6. Nf3 black can still push d5 and avoid the maroczy bind with a playable position.

This looks playable for black, and is very forcing. White has very little opportunity to deviate.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Another possible line: 6. Nf3 d5 7. exd5 e4 8. Qe2 Qe7 9. d6 exd3 10. dxe7 dxe2 11. exf8(Q)+ Rxf8 12. Kxe2 Nc6 13. Nc3 Bf5

Avatar of erikido23
SukerPuncher333 wrote:

I'm not sure how that would transpose to the Kalashnikov (maybe you could post the line leading to it).

Even after 6. Nf3 black can still push d5 and avoid the maroczy bind with a playable position.

 

This looks playable for black, and is very forcing. White has very little opportunity to deviate.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Another possible line: 6. Nf3 d5 7. exd5 e4 8. Qe2 Qe7 9. d6 exd3 10. dxe7 dxe2 11. exf8(Q)+ Rxf8 12. Kxe2 Nc6 13. Nc3 Bf5


 Its playable for black if he likes being a pawn down.....8. b-e3,qxd5 9. n-c3

 

Can you play it?  I certainly wouldn't want to be playing the black side of that against a player that is just as good as I am.  While you MAY be able to get a draw out of this with very good play(that is the case in most positions out of a good opening) you are in fact down a pawn and your best prospects are a draw(why not just play a petroffs if that is what you were looking for?)

Avatar of Nytik
KillaBeez wrote:

Play a hot novelty against a Najdorf or Dragon.  That really gets them thinking.  Maybe play something that is unsound correspondence, but nearly impossible to refute OTB


Not entirely on-topic, but I feel the fried liver attack is a good example of this. 

 

But anyway. As was said, a low win-rate for white is probably due to people played Bd3 because they don't actually know any lines! It'd probably do a lot better if people where playing it intentionally. (i.e. with some lines planned)

Avatar of CJefforT

bd3 does nothing good <-<

Avatar of SukerPuncher333
erikido23 wrote:

 Its playable for black if he likes being a pawn down.....8. b-e3,qxd5 9. n-c3

Can you play it?  I certainly wouldn't want to be playing the black side of that against a player that is just as good as I am.  While you MAY be able to get a draw out of this with very good play(that is the case in most positions out of a good opening) you are in fact down a pawn and your best prospects are a draw(why not just play a petroffs if that is what you were looking for?)


That pawn comes with a price -- white will have trouble developing the b1 knight: 8. Be3 Na6 9. a3 Nc7 10. 0-0 Nxd5 11. Nbd2 Nxf2

The burden is upon white to solve this problem. White will need to spend some tempi to get that knight out (not to mention the a1 rook), and meanwhile black tries to stir up more trouble. In master-level CC games, white might wiggle out of trouble with the extra pawn, but at club-level OTB games, I think black has good play. Besides, as white you want to create threats instead of responding to them, but now white's game plan has basically boiled down to this: grab the pawn, avoid the tactical traps, and get to the endgame.

Avatar of erikido23
CJefforT wrote:

bd3 does nothing good <-<


 you do nothing good....Ba dum ching

 

Seriously,  I would think you would recognize that b-d3 does in fact protect the e pawn.  Therefore it does in fact do something good.   

Avatar of erikido23
SukerPuncher333 wrote:
erikido23 wrote:

 Its playable for black if he likes being a pawn down.....8. b-e3,qxd5 9. n-c3

Can you play it?  I certainly wouldn't want to be playing the black side of that against a player that is just as good as I am.  While you MAY be able to get a draw out of this with very good play(that is the case in most positions out of a good opening) you are in fact down a pawn and your best prospects are a draw(why not just play a petroffs if that is what you were looking for?)


That pawn comes with a price -- white will have trouble developing the b1 knight: 8. Be3 Na6 9. a3 Nc7 10. 0-0 Nxd5 11. Nbd2 Nxf2

The burden is upon white to solve this problem. White will need to spend some tempi to get that knight out (not to mention the a1 rook), and meanwhile black tries to stir up more trouble. In master-level CC games, white might wiggle out of trouble with the extra pawn, but at club-level OTB games, I think black has good play. Besides, as white you want to create threats instead of responding to them, but now white's game plan has basically boiled down to this: grab the pawn, avoid the tactical traps, and get to the endgame.


 hmm, interesting.  I hadn't even looked at n-a6.  That might be a pretty drawish proposition actually. 

Avatar of Jaguarphd

I wouldn't call a lost pawn a lost game.

Especially my games which almost never reaches end games.

Avatar of Flibz

I sometimes do this.

Avatar of ozzie_c_cobblepot

If you hate playing against those, just play the 2.c3 Sicilian, aka the Alapin, aka the Caro-Kann Sicilian!