Is this a good way to counter London System! !? - Chess Forums - Page 2

sndeww

Mar 10, 2022

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#21

@Stil1 I think black has an improvement over 2...h6.

busterlark

Mar 10, 2022

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#22

B1ZMARK wrote:

@busterlark the bishop is often misplaced on d2 in QP openings. The bogo indian takes this to an extreme, and I suppose after Bd2 black can play Nf6, arguing that the bishop on d2 justifies the extra tempo.

In the case of Bg5 simply h6. I think that black can play g5 after Bh4, which is probably still better for white, though.

Mmmmm, good point re Bogo-Indian positions. Interesting idea, and makes sense!

I was going to post a line in response to Bg5/h6, but Stil1 beat me to it!

sndeww

Mar 10, 2022

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#23

busterlark wrote:

B1ZMARK wrote:

@busterlark the bishop is often misplaced on d2 in QP openings. The bogo indian takes this to an extreme, and I suppose after Bd2 black can play Nf6, arguing that the bishop on d2 justifies the extra tempo.

In the case of Bg5 simply h6. I think that black can play g5 after Bh4, which is probably still better for white, though.

Mmmmm, good point re Bogo-Indian positions. Interesting idea, and makes sense!

I was going to post a line in response to Bg5/h6, but Stil1 beat me to it!

That one time I was bored for four hours and messed around with 2...Nh5 on my own chessboard lol. I looked at h6 but didn't like it, so I dropped the idea, but today I just looked at 3...g6, and I think it's better.

sndeww

Mar 10, 2022

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#24

I also tried looking at if white plays c4

Donnsteinz

Mar 10, 2022

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#25

I really wanted to back you up with dynamic play for black (as is common in the 1...Nf6 lines), but try as might I couldn't . Maybe 2...Nh5 isn't really a good way for black. Especially since black has a lot of other ways to satisfactorily counter the London.

sndeww

Mar 10, 2022

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#26

Donnsteinz wrote:

I really wanted to back you up with dynamic play for black (as is common in the 1...Nf6 lines), but try as might I couldn't . Maybe 2...Nh5 isn't really a good way for black. Especially since black has a lot of other ways to satisfactorily counter the London.

Hey could you try looking at my lines with 3…g6 instead of 3…h6? I think what I wrote is playable but I might have missed some stuff, thanks

FM rychessmaster1

Mar 10, 2022

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#27

2... b6 is kinda pog

Donnsteinz

Mar 10, 2022

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#28

B1ZMARK wrote:

Donnsteinz wrote:

I really wanted to back you up with dynamic play for black (as is common in the 1...Nf6 lines), but try as might I couldn't . Maybe 2...Nh5 isn't really a good way for black. Especially since black has a lot of other ways to satisfactorily counter the London.

Hey could you try looking at my lines with 3…g6 instead of 3…h6? I think what I wrote is playable but I might have missed some stuff, thanks

I covered ...g6 ideas in the lines following 3.Bd2. I don't think the evaluation changes with the placement of the bishop. In any case a bishop on g5 should normally be even better for white than a bishop on d2.

sndeww

Mar 10, 2022

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#29

Donnsteinz wrote:

B1ZMARK wrote:

Donnsteinz wrote:

I really wanted to back you up with dynamic play for black (as is common in the 1...Nf6 lines), but try as might I couldn't . Maybe 2...Nh5 isn't really a good way for black. Especially since black has a lot of other ways to satisfactorily counter the London.

Hey could you try looking at my lines with 3…g6 instead of 3…h6? I think what I wrote is playable but I might have missed some stuff, thanks

I covered ...g6 ideas in the lines following 3.Bd2. I don't think the evaluation changes with the placement of the bishop. In any case a bishop on g5 should normally be even better for white than a bishop on d2.

well, with 3.Bd2 I think 3...Nf6 is ok, as you're in a QP position and the bishop often doesn't want to be on d2.

alphaous

Mar 10, 2022

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#30

ESP-918 wrote:

ThrillerFan wrote:

ESP-918 wrote:

Guys please stay on topic , I'm asking about particular scenario which I mentioned above.

Well, I tried to help you, but if that's going to be your attitude, then the simple, blunt answer is NO! 2...Nh5 is utter crap!

Crap? How so ?

King's Gambit crap as well , yet Ian Neponitchia played it in classical .

And I'm not planning on playing classical or with GMs .

Don't listen to him. He calls anything that is a half-point inferior to mainline theory utter crap without providing explanations. Sometimes he is correct, but mostly he is rude.

ThrillerFan

Mar 10, 2022

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#31

B1ZMARK wrote:

@busterlark the bishop is often misplaced on d2 in QP openings. The bogo indian takes this to an extreme, and I suppose after Bd2 black can play Nf6, arguing that the bishop on d2 justifies the extra tempo.

In the case of Bg5 simply h6. I think that black can play g5 after Bh4, which is probably still better for white, though.

Why even move the Bishop?

1.d4 Nf6 2.Bf4 Nh5? 3.e3! and if 3...Nxf4 4.exf4, White has:

1) Total domination of e5 with the 2 pawns and an upcoming Nf3.

2) The ability to get all of his pieces out quickly. Nf3, Bd3, Nbd2, c3, Qc2/b3/a4, O-O, etc. Black has done nothing but take his knight off the board.

Clear advantage for White!

sndeww

Mar 10, 2022

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#32

ThrillerFan wrote:

B1ZMARK wrote:

@busterlark the bishop is often misplaced on d2 in QP openings. The bogo indian takes this to an extreme, and I suppose after Bd2 black can play Nf6, arguing that the bishop on d2 justifies the extra tempo.

In the case of Bg5 simply h6. I think that black can play g5 after Bh4, which is probably still better for white, though.

Why even move the Bishop?

1.d4 Nf6 2.Bf4 Nh5? 3.e3! and if 3...Nxf4 4.exf4, White has:

1) Total domination of e5 with the 2 pawns and an upcoming Nf3.

2) The ability to get all of his pieces out quickly. Nf3, Bd3, Nbd2, c3, Qc2/b3/a4, O-O, etc. Black has done nothing but take his knight off the board.

Clear advantage for White!

After exf4, Black may just play something normal like d5 followed by Bf5. He has a clear pawn break with c5. While white does have complete control over e5, I don’t think it’s enough for a clear advantage.

Mikhail60Mikhail

Mar 12, 2022

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#33

Look up the Grunfeld defence - Burille variation. It plays beautifully against the accelerated London and normal London system

busterlark

Mar 12, 2022

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#34

ThrillerFan wrote:

Why even move the Bishop?

1.d4 Nf6 2.Bf4 Nh5? 3.e3! and if 3...Nxf4 4.exf4, White has:

1) Total domination of e5 with the 2 pawns and an upcoming Nf3.

2) The ability to get all of his pieces out quickly. Nf3, Bd3, Nbd2, c3, Qc2/b3/a4, O-O, etc. Black has done nothing but take his knight off the board.

Clear advantage for White!

Doesn't black just have d6 and Bg4? And then black can just play g6, Bg7, and c5, and have basically no problems?