Openings for Maximum Blundering

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Musikamole

Michael Quigley shows several ways where Black can go wrong after 1.g4 d5 2.Bg2 Bxg4 - Grob Gambit Accepted. To view the video lecture, click here: http://www.chesscomvideos.com/2010/03/chesscom-podcast-51-grob-attack.html

It’s quite tempting to try openings in Blitz where my opponents have even more chances to make mistakes. I’m exploring the King’s Gambit for this same purpose.

Has anyone here played the Grob with success? In your Blitz games, what opening(s) do you find your opponents blundering in the most?


Notes taken from The Grob Attack by Michael Quigley

 I found one variation where White can go terribly wrong after 1.g4 d5 2.Bg2 Bxg4 3.c4 c6 4.Qb3 Qc7 5.cxd5 e6 6.dxc6 Nxc6 7.Qg3 0-0-0 8.Qxg4??


Musikamole
ajedrecito wrote:

Please don't waste your time on stuff like this. It pains me to see it. Sure, there are plenty of ways to go wrong if Black takes your g4 pawn for Black, but White suffers from a weakened kingside for the entire game and even in blitz this isn't good unless you are extremely familiar with the resulting positions.


Ouch!  I was watching the video while exercising this morning. It peeked my curiosity, nothing more.

What about opening with the King's Gambit? At my chess club during a 5 0 Blitz tournament, I lost quickly after my opponent opened with 1.e4 e5 2.f4. I wasn't familiar with 2.f4 at all, and lost in just a few moves after playing 2...exf4. Turns out, it was his pet line. Since it was Blitz, I don't have a score card for the game.

I don't know, but 1.g4 is a very strange looking move, and I have won against it in Live Chess, but only because my opponents didn't do anything as clever as what I saw on the video. Sure, a player with a high tactics rating will not make the mistakes found in the Grob video, but against players at my level, it is much easier.

Conquistador

I used to play this as my main line.  Check out my Grob/Borg group for my theory on the Grob revival.  I have done a lot of theory, but others there have added quite a bit there as well.

http://www.chess.com/groups/home/1g4-1g5-grob-org

LavaRook

@Musik

Sure, people may fall into a trap or two but you should never "hope" for this to happen and play an opening solely for the cheapo

Sure, you may win games b/c of it and all, but are you really learning anything from them as people fall into the traps over and over (if they do)? For fun occasionally or when bored or whatever, sure but don't make it like your staple or anything.

I don't know much about the KG but I would think playing it would be fine.

waffllemaster

Positions that  result from a classic line in the caro are often difficult for me to evaluate correctly.  It begins like this

bresando

http://www.chess.com/tournament/grob-oppening-special

This is a tournament i'm playing in. There are some strong players and you can look at how they handle the grob.

My personal recommendation: stay away from it. W has not more practical chances than B. In fact W king has not a safe place to go and this means that even when your opponent falls in a trap and you should be winning, B can still put up a good fight and win with a swindle.

waffllemaster
ajedrecito wrote:

About the Caro-line posted in post #9 I can recommend a lot to you if you are interested in either side (but I can't recommend it for white given recent tournament practice) and it is known as the Shirov variation by most.


Thanks, but I don't want to put in the work it would take to get this up to tourney level (and from  you say you don't recommend it for tournament play anyway :)

It is fun for club play though... do you have any illustrative games or quick tips maybe?  (For the white player)

Musikamole
LavaRook wrote:

@Musik

Sure, people may fall into a trap or two but you should never "hope" for this to happen and play an opening solely for the cheapo

Sure, you may win games b/c of it and all, but are you really learning anything from them as people fall into the traps over and over (if they do)? For fun occasionally or when bored or whatever, sure but don't make it like your staple or anything.

I don't know much about the KG but I would think playing it would be fine.


Excellent point. I'd learn next to nothing about chess from playing The Grob. I may pull The Grob out just to check for alertness with my elementary chess students, and they will learn the basic traps associated with that opening. It must suck to lose to The Grob.

The King's Gambit is a completely different story, and may be one of the best openings to play as a beginner.

I already learned a lot just from reading IM John Watson's take on White's idea behind the move 2.f4.

1. Exchanging a flank pawn for a center pawn (2...exf4), giving White a central majority.

2. White gains the open f-file after ...exf4 or fxe5.

3. White strives for quick development with Nf3, Bc4 and 0-0. Getting in d4 and Bxf4 would give White ideal piece placement.

4. The weak f7-square is a target both from Bc4 and a rook on the newly opened f-file.

Now, will Black give White all of the above? Extremely doubtful, but at least I know what my goals are out of the opening, which is basically Development 101 with a heavy emphasis on pressuring the weak f7-square.

Last, I may get to play this opening often at my level, as after 1.e4, I mostly see 1...e5. I don't see the Sicilian, for example. I'm not sure why. I do see the Scandinavian. (1.e4 d5). I see the French sometimes, but not the Caro-Kann.

As part of my very basic opening preparation before any chess club tournament, I will be booked up on the King's Gambit before I give it a spin. I don't want to be surprised by something like the Falkbeer Counter-Gambit (1.e4 e5 2.f4 d5), nor the standard King's Gambit Declined second moves, like 2...Bc5, a very strong move.

In the first five moves, I don't expect to see any surprises really, unless someone makes a bad move. I see that as an advantage for me, and it will come down, as always, to who is stronger in tactics and checkmates. Sounds good.

Musikamole

I got several basic lines in the King's Gambit from FCO (Fundamental Chess Openings). GM Paul van der Sterren's writing style is a delight, as well as his very simple explanations for beginners, particularly the way he covers the ideas behind each opening. It's far easier and more entertaining to read than IM John Watson's Master the Chess Openings, Volume 1, 1.e4.


King’s Gambit 1.e4 e5 2.f4

King’s Gambit Accepted 1.e4 e5 2.f4 exf4

King’s Gambit Declined 1.e4 e5 2.f4 Bc5

Classical Variation 1.e4 e5 2.f4 exf4 3.Nf3 g5

Modern Variation  1.e4 e5 2.f4 exf4 3.Nf3 d5

Polerio Gambit/Muzio Gambit 1.e4 e5 2.f4 exf4 3.Nf3 g5 4.Bc4 g4 5.0-0 gxf3 6.Qxf3. This was once called the classical position of the King’s Gambit.

Kieseritzky Gambit 1.e4 e5 2.f4 exf4 3.Nf3 g5 4.h4 g4 5.Ne5

Allgaier Gambit 1.e4 e5 2.f4 exf4 3.Nf3 g5 4.h4 g4 5.Ne5 Ng5

Bishop’s Gambit 1.e4 e5 2.f4 exf4 3.Bc4

Falkbeer Counter-Gambit 1.e4 e5 2.f4 d5

Becker Defense 1.e4 e5 2.f4 exf4 3.Nf3 h6

Fischer Defense 1.e4 e5 2.f4 exf4 3.Nf3 d6


 

Musikamole
Estragon wrote:

The Grob is a gimmick opening only, it weakens White's Kingside without promoting central control or development.  It's not recommended for anyone at any level for any time control or any reason, period.

Concerning the KG as a secondary opening, it is often better to choose a second opening which shares at least some characteristics with your main line.  So if you play the Scotch, the Italian would be close, or if you want something less well known, the Four Knights Game perhaps. 

This way you don't have to learn two completely different systems, and the knowledge and experience you have gained in your main line may prove useful in your back-up opening.


I play the Scotch Gambit, which gives me the Italian Bc4. The Italian (1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bc4) looks promising for getting in some Evans Gambit or Two Knights/Fried Liver Attack games, depending on whether Black plays 3...Bc5 or 3...Nf6. If Black plays 3...Bc5, I will play 4.b4. I've had a training game in this line, and I understand the ideas behind 4.b4. If Black plays 3...Nf6, I'll punt with 4.Ng5, with the hope of getting in a wild Fried Liver or a Traxler.

I have no idea what primary opening would best compliment the King's Gambit. Do you?

---

Update - GM Boris Alterman from ICC refers to the King's Gambit as part of the Italian Gambit Style. He also mentions Gioachino Greco as being the father of the Italian Gambit Style. 

Musikamole
mephistoWaltzz wrote:

forget accepted, classical, Kiezeritzky and the long whip (5...h5 from medieval days), becker, fischer (he states that this is best, however Its outdated and too closed and passive). really consider modern and falkbeer. You don't need to deal with a shaky kingside or any immediate threats. #7 shows the basics of it. I don't know, fischer might work good but its one of those too advanced for me . Muzio leads to a draw.


I can't forget any of  Black's possible responses, since I plan on opening the game with 1.e4, and if my opponent follows with 1...e5, I will play 2.f4 with no hesitation. It is my greatest desire that Black accepts the gambit pawn. All other lines look far less pleasant for White.

If White opens with 1.e4, I'll thump him over the head with my new weapon, 1...c5! I don't see anyone at the chess club playing the Sicilian, so maybe I will shake things up a bit. 

I can already here it. But you are a beginner! You should not be playing the Sicilian yet. Stick to the open game of 1.e4 e5.

I'm probably wrong again by not playing 1...e5. No surprise. So far, I have no problems understanding the basic goals for each side in this semi-open game. Besides, the game is completely imbalanced and dynamic, with tons of tactical opportunities, and I need lots of practice in tactics.

InternationalPatzer

The grob is certainly not a good choice for an opening, that being said, I was bored and decided to test it out in a blitz game against a 1600 here on live chess.

Not really a very good game but figured I may as well post it having played it.

 

Regarding the kings gambit, it is certainly a very fun opening to play and good for tactical players. I play it occasionally, when I play it I play the Bishops gambit,
1.e4 e5 2.f4 exf4 3.Bc4
LavaRook

@Musik

Yes, the Sicilian is very tactical but then you have to know a lot of theory and studying theory isn't recommended. THere are complex tactics that may seemingly pop out of nowhere like a Bxe6/Nxe6/Nf5/or Nd5 sac that I'm sure an expert at your club will know about and use. They may not be totally accurate sometimes, but you need to defend very well...

That being said, if your playing just for fun you can try it I guess.

Musikamole
LavaRook wrote:

@Musik

Yes, the Sicilian is very tactical but then you have to know a lot of theory and studying theory isn't recommended. There are complex tactics that may seemingly pop out of nowhere like a Bxe6/Nxe6/Nf5/or Nd5 sac that I'm sure an expert at your club will know about and use. They may not be totally accurate sometimes, but you need to defend very well...

That being said, if your playing just for fun you can try it I guess.


Thanks for the heads up. Those complex tactics are way above my skill level. I'll give the Sicilian a try against a few friends at the club who are around my skill level, and stick with 1...e5 against the better players. Thank you.

Musikamole
ajedrecito wrote:

3.Bc4 seems fundamentally better than 3.Nf3 although I'd need Gonnosuke to tell me if I'm just wrong about this. My impression of it is that it is simply a more accurate move as 3...Qh4+ is not very threatening.

(I refer of course to the King's Gambit Accepted with 3.Bc4, i.e. 1.e4 e5 2.f4 exf4 3.Bc4)

1.e4 e5 2.f4 Bc5 is very difficult for White to meet. The critical lines seem to involve a Na4 followed by taking the Bishop.


GM Boris Alterman refers to Gioachino Greco as the Father of the Italian Gambit Style during his 5 part video series on the King's Gambit. This does make sense when you think of the initial piece placement for White with Nf3 and Bc4. The gambit pawn is the only difference for White. It makes the King's Gambit less of a mystery for me.

 


 

 

 

 

 

 

 


What follows are some historical games from Alterman's first lecture. I added a chess engine continuation in game two starting with 8.h3.