Ponziani opening traps
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How does one continue from this position after 5 ...Qg5?
blunderking you are giving a variation for White with a blunder for White on the 4th move and then asking how White should proceed after the blunder?
The answer is that White should not make the blunder in the first place.
The only correct move after 3. c3 d5 is 4.Qa4
4.Qa4 is not the "only correct move".
4.d3 is respectable, playing a philidor reverse.
all this is abstract.
If for u, a correct opening for white is one who brings theorical advantage, then sorry but Ponziani doesnt give it, so why not d3...
It is a bit the same spirit than spanish with d3, where white doesnt go forward too soon, prefering to develop smoothly before the storm.
It is not a failure, but we have to understand that nowadays, there is no real theorical advantage for white in the main lines (ruy lopez, scotch, giuoco piano), thus why not a philidor with white, it can make sense.
Nov 29, 2016
0
#369
richie_and_oprah wrote:
If the best chance for White is to play as if they were Black, then the game has fundamental flaws and is not what it has been purported to be.
A game isn't a theoretical discussion on perfect play though. It's often about taking a lot of correct practical decisions. I often accept equal positions as white out of the opening as long as I feel I understand the positions better than my opponent.
I recently used an early d3 to avoid the ridiculous prep my opponent had in the Spanish Marshal gambit. I won the game. A few weeks later my opponent beat and drew two masters (one of them in a miniature) in that opening after they went for main lines.
Nov 29, 2016
0
#370
I am pretty sure Carlsen made the same comment about the Philidor when he played the Ponziani; however in Philidor, black has not played c6. How does that specific extra move affect the Black position? I don't know. I don't play the Philidor.
But 4. Qa4 gives Black more challenges to meet... It is also probably equal but why not make black play best moves that are harder to find?
poucin wrote:
4.Qa4 is not the "only correct move".
4.d3 is respectable, playing a philidor reverse.
Or a mix of them: 4.Qa4 f6 (the recommendation of most opening sources) 5.d3, when the pawn at f6 is a bit odd for a Philidor structure.
Nov 29, 2016
0
#372
yeah, the line 4. Qa4 f6 5. d3 is double edged... but 4. ... f6 is not a natural move to find and unlikely to be met under 2200 over the board. Maybe if you were preparing for the Ponziani...
4...f6 is not the only good move anyway.
Personnally i like Bd7, and Nf6 is quite ok too.
Nov 30, 2016
0
#374
poucin wrote:
4...f6 is not the only good move anyway.
Personnally i like Bd7, and Nf6 is quite ok too.
Two gambit lines... You would probably lose those games to a Ponziani player. Especially 4. ... Nf6.
it is just a game, the better will usually win.
Black will chose the set up which fits its style.
Some would prefer Nf5, other f6, and other Bd7.
Gambiting against Ponziani player is not really a problem, why should it be?
And all this is on d5, Nf6 is another story...
Like most openings, there are many possiblities, up to u to chose the one u like, its not about "my god, gambiting against Ponziani player and playing on his field!" "ok but its mine too! ^^"
ponz111. Many Blitz players in Ponz, KGA, Evans, et. al., choose inferior lines because they know all the traps. 4. Bb5 was played against me, even though it's annotated ?! (which is bad idea not blunder, yes?). I played 4...dxe4, 5. Nxe5 and after my 5...Qd5, my opponent knew the moves better and won on time. In GM Larry Kaufman's book "The Chess Advantage in Black & White" he recommends 5...Qg5. It's pure tactical fireworks. Since this was first edition 2004, his engine was Fritz 2003, I am curious if there is a better punishment than he shows.
blunderking To answer your question, after 3. c3 d5 4. Bb5 is a bad move and is answered by 5. ...Qg5.
There is a whole chapter in my co authored book explaining why 4. Bb5 is a bad move.
If you wish to have the Ponziani as a first or 2nd weapon--you should learn the lines with 3. c3 d5 4. Qa4
blunderking2 wrote:
ponz111. Many Blitz players in Ponz, KGA, Evans, et. al., choose inferior lines because they know all the traps. 4. Bb5 was played against me, even though it's annotated ?! (which is bad idea not blunder, yes?). I played 4...dxe4, 5. Nxe5 and after my 5...Qd5, my opponent knew the moves better and won on time. In GM Larry Kaufman's book "The Chess Advantage in Black & White" he recommends 5...Qg5. It's pure tactical fireworks. Since this was first edition 2004, his engine was Fritz 2003, I am curious if there is a better punishment than he shows.
Oh dear, call me stupid but why not after 4 Bb5 Qg5 we don't just have 5Nxg5!
GDring wrote:
blunderking2 wrote:
ponz111. Many Blitz players in Ponz, KGA, Evans, et. al., choose inferior lines because they know all the traps. 4. Bb5 was played against me, even though it's annotated ?! (which is bad idea not blunder, yes?). I played 4...dxe4, 5. Nxe5 and after my 5...Qd5, my opponent knew the moves better and won on time. In GM Larry Kaufman's book "The Chess Advantage in Black & White" he recommends 5...Qg5. It's pure tactical fireworks. Since this was first edition 2004, his engine was Fritz 2003, I am curious if there is a better punishment than he shows.
Oh dear, call me stupid but why not after 4 Bb5 Qg5 we don't just have 5Nxg5!
You have forgotten 4...dxe4, 5.Nxe5...that is the relevance to 5...Qg5 which attacks the Knight and the g-pawn.
cant play ponziani on me
i play Alekhine