Ranking all responses to e4 - Chess Forums - Page 4

PawnHurricanes

Jun 4, 2023

0

#61

Specifically against the Caro btw

Ethan_Brollier

Jun 4, 2023

0

#62

TheSampson wrote:

PawnHurricanes wrote:

TheSampson wrote:

PawnHurricanes wrote:

SamuelAjedrez95 wrote:

PawnHurricanes wrote:

I guess, I was thinking more about club level and thinking about the fact that there are around 10-15 responses to e4 c5 as well

This is the same as saying there are 20 responses to 1. e4, so you shouldn't bother with 1. e4, when over half of those responses are not considerably challenging.

but they are challenging, that's the point

Against e4 or the Sicilian?

The sicilian. Maybe there aren't 10 on move 2, but think about all of the variations by move 5, even.

I think GothamChess is getting to your brain. There’s only 1 really challenging Sicilian variation: the Open Sicilian. Everything else can be taken care of by studying for 5 minutes, 20 minutes max, even the Smith-Morra. There are a few decent Anti-Sicilians like the Rossolimo, but the Sicilian Defense is not a hard opening to learn, speaking from a player who turned from a Gotham stan to a Najdorf Sicilian player.

This is simply incorrect. Closed and Rossolimo both have theory books nearly as deep as the Open. And aside from that, there are some funky sidelines you have to learn no matter what you play. It’s a tad more difficult than you’d think.

TheSampson

Jun 4, 2023

0

#63

Ethan_Brollier wrote:

TheSampson wrote:

PawnHurricanes wrote:

TheSampson wrote:

PawnHurricanes wrote:

SamuelAjedrez95 wrote:

PawnHurricanes wrote:

I guess, I was thinking more about club level and thinking about the fact that there are around 10-15 responses to e4 c5 as well

This is the same as saying there are 20 responses to 1. e4, so you shouldn't bother with 1. e4, when over half of those responses are not considerably challenging.

but they are challenging, that's the point

Against e4 or the Sicilian?

The sicilian. Maybe there aren't 10 on move 2, but think about all of the variations by move 5, even.

I think GothamChess is getting to your brain. There’s only 1 really challenging Sicilian variation: the Open Sicilian. Everything else can be taken care of by studying for 5 minutes, 20 minutes max, even the Smith-Morra. There are a few decent Anti-Sicilians like the Rossolimo, but the Sicilian Defense is not a hard opening to learn, speaking from a player who turned from a Gotham stan to a Najdorf Sicilian player.

This is simply incorrect. Closed and Rossolimo both have theory books nearly as deep as the Open. And aside from that, there are some funky sidelines you have to learn no matter what you play. It’s a tad more difficult than you’d think.

I did kind of exaggerate, but the Sicilian is not a hard opening to learn nonetheless

Ethan_Brollier

Jun 4, 2023

0

#64

PawnHurricanes wrote:

What 15 responses? I can think of these options for white:

Exchange

Panov

Advance

Nc3/d2 which is the same

Fantasy

Two Ponies

Can anyone think of any others?

Breyer, Nf3 Breyer, Toikannen Accelerated Panov, 2. b3, 3. Bd3, Perseus Gambit, ICBM nonsense, and then in the Advance there’s the Short, Tal, Apocalypse, Van der Weir. I’m definitely forgetting a few but that’s most of them.

SamuelAjedrez95

Jun 4, 2023

0

#65

PawnHurricanes wrote:

What 15 responses? I can think of these options for white:

Exchange

Panov

Advance

Nc3/d2 which is the same

Fantasy

Two Ponies

Can anyone think of any others?

Those are the main responses.

And most of those responses have much better results against the Caro-Kann than anything against the Sicilian.

They are fewer main responses against the Caro-Kann because more people do well and are comfortable against the Caro-Kann in these responses, than the Sicilian.

More people try these sidelines against the Sicilian specifically because they are struggling more to find such an advantage. (because there is none to be found)

A lot of the time that an opening has more played responses is because people are struggling more to find a move which they feel comfortable with against it. A lot of lesser openings have fewer played responses because the main ones are perfectly good against it.

A good example would be the Scandinavian. It's an inferior opening but there's basically only 1 popular response to it, because it does it's job well.

Against the Caro-Kann, the Advance, Classical Nc3, Panov Attack and even Fantasy, do perfectly well against it so there's no reason to look for anything else.

Against the Sicilian, people try all these different moves and STILL can't find a comfortable advantage against it.

SamuelAjedrez95

Jun 4, 2023

0

#66

TheSampson wrote:

I did kind of exaggerate, but the Sicilian is not a hard opening to learn nonetheless

It can be complicated and hard to learn in some ways, but it's worth it. Also it depends on motivation, it can be fun and interesting to learn as well.

Zack_BTW

Jun 5, 2023

0

#67

so e4.

Yorshka90

Jun 5, 2023

0

#68

C6, the goat.

PawnHurricanes

Jun 7, 2023

0

#69

ScrumptiousBricks wrote:

you guys are tripping 😭😭😭

this is the only correct list I’ve seen in the forums

well, half-right, the sicilian is ranked way too high

Talk about gotham getting to people's heads lmao

PawnHurricanes

Jun 7, 2023

0

#70

after our discussion I was second-guessing the Caro at #1 though personally I've had better results with it over the Sicilian

PawnHurricanes

Jun 7, 2023

0

#71

Having played both