what do you play after 1.d4

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Avatar of TheRoboticNoob

I need some good lines to study as black after d4, maybe 1 or 2 simple lines

Avatar of TheRoboticNoob

also i just saw someone else with this exact same post

Avatar of ArchimedesSY

Maybe London it's 1.d4 ... 2. Bf4

Avatar of tygxc

Simplest is 1 d4 d5 an now either 2 c4 dxc4 or 2...e6 or 2...c6

Avatar of 1e4c6_O-1

nf6

Avatar of SwimmerBill

Why should you play what I play? My lines are based on aiming for positions that I like to play--figure out what you like to play and aim for those structures in your openings.   (as for what I play after  d4, in blitz games I'll try lots of stuff: g6, d5 and Tartakower QGD, d4 and Tarrasch & semi-Tarrasch, d4 with e6 and c6 and then f5 if I get the chance [stonewall dutch by transposition]. These are mostly defenses where I get free piece play in return for a long term weakness. Many strong players got high ratings by studiously avoiding positions with long term weaknesses, s figure out what you want for the middlegame and aim for that.

--Just my opinion, Bill

Avatar of zone_chess

Play the Modern - Pterodactyl. 1...g6 2...c5 and take on d4 when you can. Nf6 and d6 releases the LSB to g4. Middlegames get very tactical if you focus on bringing the knights up. For example Ng4 instead of Bg4.

Avatar of pfren

QGD, Tarrasch Defence.

A dynamic approach, with plenty of tactics. Also good for 1.c4, and 1.Nf3.

At your level though, the best "line" is not hanging pieces.

Avatar of ThrillerFan
pfren wrote:

QGD, Tarrasch Defence.

A dynamic approach, with plenty of tactics. Also good for 1.c4, and 1.Nf3.

At your level though, the best "line" is not hanging pieces.

 

QGD Tarrasch Defense is a problem for Black now-a-days.  You need almost perfect play to survive after 1.d4 d5 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 c5 4.cxd5 exd5 5.Nf3 Nc6 6.dxc5!! - After the old 6.g3, Black is fine.

Avatar of Keystoner

Nf6, e6, d5. Those 3 moves for black for practically everything white plays after d4.

Avatar of BlueHen86

I used to play 1. d4 followed by 2. e3 and then play a Stonewall Attack. I had a lot of success with it at first, as my rating went up, I found it to be less effective against higher rated players. I still play it occasionally in blitz because I know the set up and can play the first 7-10 moves quickly against most moves by black. 

Avatar of TheRoboticNoob
pfren wrote:

QGD, Tarrasch Defence.

A dynamic approach, with plenty of tactics. Also good for 1.c4, and 1.Nf3.

At your level though, the best "line" is not hanging pieces.

not all 700s hang pieces

i just need help with middle game plans and ideas

Avatar of SwimmerBill
TheRoboticNoob wrote:
pfren wrote:

QGD, Tarrasch Defence.

not all 700s hang pieces

i just need help with middle game plans and ideas

 Bezgodov has a book on the Tarrasch with more than 300 annotated games. If you play thru all 300 you will start to pick up pieces and drop them on the right place without thinking.

The line Thrillerfan refers to ['delayed early capture'] is popular for white players who are good at end games, want a draw and maybe a win if black messes up. It is testing so you'd need to setup the position and play vs computers of increasing strength until you feel you can hold a draw vs somewhat stronger players. Black needs to readjust thinking to being patient.

-Bill

Avatar of EKAFC
pfren wrote:

QGD, Tarrasch Defence.

I found one game of yours against Tsarouhas where you played the Schara Gambit. I've heard from Shankland that it's not so good for short time controls due to needing time to calculate a good defense. Do you recommend it or should we go for the pure Tarrasch instead?

Avatar of SwimmerBill
EKAFC wrote:
pfren wrote:

QGD, Tarrasch Defence.

I found one game of yours against Tsarouhas where you played the Schara Gambit. I've heard from Shankland that it's not so good for short time controls due to needing time to calculate a good defense. Do you recommend it or should we go for the pure Tarrasch instead?

 I'm interested in what pfren responds.

I'm old and slow and lower rated but I've been experimenting with it in blitz at the club. There isnt that much theory to it so why not watch a video and start playing it? So far, I've won every game as black vs USCF A players and in every game when I reconstruct positions and analyze by computer I find lots of tactics missed. (My theory is that the tactics in it are not thematic in my other openings so my 'antenna' isnt tuned for them.)   I'd want to start picking up more of the tactics before playing it in a real , slow time control rated, game. 

so try it and see if you have fun

-Bill

Avatar of pfren
ThrillerFan wrote:
pfren wrote:

QGD, Tarrasch Defence.

A dynamic approach, with plenty of tactics. Also good for 1.c4, and 1.Nf3.

At your level though, the best "line" is not hanging pieces.

 

QGD Tarrasch Defense is a problem for Black now-a-days.  You need almost perfect play to survive after 1.d4 d5 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 c5 4.cxd5 exd5 5.Nf3 Nc6 6.dxc5!! - After the old 6.g3, Black is fine.

 

The 6.dxc5 line is nowadays analysed to death, and to a draw.

More than that, whoever does not like playing this line, can play (1.d4 d5 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 c5 4.cxd5 exd5 5.Nf3) 5...Nf6, where 6.dxc5? is simply a mistake.

This was supposed to be bad for Black after 6.Bg5, but actually computers have shown that Black is fine after 6...Be6!, and currently the line is very trendy.

Avatar of pfren
TheRoboticNoob wrote:

not all 700s hang pieces

 

Very true. Some of them prefer hanging their king instead.

Avatar of pfren
EKAFC wrote:
pfren wrote:

QGD, Tarrasch Defence.

I found one game of yours against Tsarouhas where you played the Schara Gambit. I've heard from Shankland that it's not so good for short time controls due to needing time to calculate a good defense. Do you recommend it or should we go for the pure Tarrasch instead?

 

The main problem with the Schara (which is entirely sound) is that in some lines Black has to settle for an early draw.

My game with Kostas (Tsarouhas) from that open in Cyprus last year is dreadful:

Black got a very comfortable equality around move 13, and then he (...which is read as "I") played all sort of nonsense to get a totally hopeless pawn-down ending, which somehow white failed to convert.

And of course the Schara cannot be a repertoire opening: it is applicable only against 3.Nc3.

 

 

 

Avatar of TTY_500

I play 1... Nf6

Avatar of SwimmerBill
pfren wrote:

 

My game with Kostas (Tsarouhas) from that open in Cyprus last year is dreadful:

Black got a very comfortable equality around move 13, and then he (...which is read as "I") played all sort of nonsense to get a totally hopeless pawn-down ending, which somehow white failed to convert.

And of course the Schara cannot be a repertoire opening: it is applicable only against 3.Nc3.

 Can you comment on the line with Na6-c5 that I see most playing today vs the older line with Nc6, Bc5 Qe7 OOO and g5 ??

Thanks--- Bill