What do you think of the Caro-Kann?

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plexinico
Dark_Falcon wrote:

probably one of the most boring openings ever...fits perfectly to people who get excited with the QGD exchange variation...

Maybe you should check some of Kasparov's games in the QGD exchange if you haven't...  And I don't mean it in a bad way

Dark_Falcon
plexinico hat geschrieben:
Dark_Falcon wrote:

probably one of the most boring openings ever...fits perfectly to people who get excited with the QGD exchange variation...

Maybe you should check some of Kasparov's games in the QGD exchange if you haven't...  And I don't mean it in a bad way

Yes, maybe...thats Garry K., but most amateur games in the QGD exchange is about fighting for a half-open c-file, an isolated pawn or a minority attack on the queenside and then ending in a 60 moves rook endgame...

Sorry, thats not my kind of chess...but if someone likes it, he should play it.

JSlavik
kjuttaP wrote:

The Caro, or "halfcicilian",is ok when playing for a draw against equal competition, or sometimes beat slightly weaker players, but against markedly stronger players, its just one horrendous way to lose

You obviously don't play the caro enough if you think it is horrendous against stronger players, or always draws even players. The caro is as good as anything else when it comes to playing people of any strength. At every level black should have an equal position with fine winning chances. It's true that some lines are more drawish than others, but this doesn't mean that by playing the caro you are setting out to draw the game on move 1, and there are plenty of opportunities to go for a win as black. Having trouble against markedly stronger players is expected, and it has nothing to do with what opening you use. Just work on your endgames. 

TheArtofWar82

I just started taking the game really seriously and last night, very late, I auto piloted an opening and responded to 1.e4 c6 with 2.nf3 instead of d4 and wound up in a terrible position.  Naturally, anytime someone surrenders control of the center I know to take it but just made a mindless blunder last night.

Unmaster

It was good enough for Keres to play, and good enough for Fischer to lose to, more than once.  

 

http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1044092

 

So it's good enough for me.  Wink

Remellion
TheArtofWar82 wrote:

I just started taking the game really seriously and last night, very late, I auto piloted an opening and responded to 1.e4 c6 with 2.nf3 instead of d4 and wound up in a terrible position.  Naturally, anytime someone surrenders control of the center I know to take it but just made a mindless blunder last night.

Not a blunder at all, it's another mainline. 1. e4 c6 2. Nf3 d5 3. Nc3, the 2 Knights' Caro-Kann, but you've gotta know how to handle it. Quite different from the mainline Caro-Kann in that you want development before central control, although both still feature heavily.

Phelon
BMeck wrote:
Mainline_Novelty wrote:
BMeck wrote:

I think the caro kann is the best reply to e4. Unless one is in a must win situation, then a extremely sharp line in the sicilian would suffice

An extremely sharp Sicilian line would result in a forced draw if White wants it...

If that was the case the sicilian would never be played

Its the case. And people wont play mainline sharp sicilians when their opponent just needs a draw to secure first place and they need a win! So many forced draws in the sicilian, the carokann is the right choice when youre opponent is playing for a draw and you want a chance to play a good winnable game.

Mainline_Novelty
Phelon wrote:
BMeck wrote:
Mainline_Novelty wrote:
BMeck wrote:

I think the caro kann is the best reply to e4. Unless one is in a must win situation, then a extremely sharp line in the sicilian would suffice

An extremely sharp Sicilian line would result in a forced draw if White wants it...

If that was the case the sicilian would never be played

Its the case. And people wont play mainline sharp sicilians when their opponent just needs a draw to secure first place and they need a win! So many forced draws in the sicilian, the carokann is the right choice when youre opponent is playing for a draw and you want a chance to play a good winnable game.

(Adding) Gawain Jones once said he plays the Dragon when he wants to draw, and the Caro when he wants to win.

TitanCG

So you are claiming that 1.e4 c5 is a draw. That sounds a bit dramatic.

BMeck

I never mentioned which line of the Sicilian.... I just said extremely sharp, which is relative to the player

ViktorHNielsen
TitanCG wrote:

So you are claiming that 1.e4 c5 is a draw. That sounds a bit dramatic.

White can probably force a draw more easily than in the caro-kann... IF he is rated over 2700. For human beings the sicilian creates more winning chances.

bgibbs

I play the Scandinavian Defense 2.Nf6 variation often because I am very aggressive in my play and try to wrest the initative away from White with systems like the Icelandic gambit, Portuguese variation, etc.

As such, I had great difficulties when White played the dubious 2. e5?! (giving Black a French or CK with an extra move), closing the center. Looked to the French and CK systems for a better understanding on how to deal with it.

I had always shyed away from the CK because of all the "boring" predjudice against it, but after studying the lines in more depth I have become quite fond of it and have added it as one of my main systems against e4.

I only mention my Scandinavian system to illustrate that not all CK players are defensive, and not all prejudice about a system is necessarily warranted/deserved. If I play the CK against someone and they decide to go wild, I welcome the chaos!

BMeck

I think some players do not understand that GM play is much different than how we play. Just because you watched a GM game that was in a slav defence and thought it was boring does not mean the opening is boring. They just know how to play agianst most lines. Any opening at our level has potential to be exciting. As for the caro kann, I played games with it where I won because of a exciting tactic, but I also won by slowly choking the life out of my opponent because my endgame pawn structure was better. 

konhidras

Loved the Caro-Kann win or lose. Its my only defense against e4 as black.

Penguininja

Its an ok opening. However it can lead to a lot of draws and it's not very aggresive. I used to play it, however i found myself getting too passive and switched to e5 recently.

bobbyDK

I play Caro Kann a lot actually I have been playing it for 5 years.

I see that a lot of players lose against it because they try to attack too hard too early.

have my own ideas in Caro Kann and still studying it.

Penguininja
bobbyDK wrote:

I play Caro Kann a lot actually I have been playing it for 5 years.

I see that a lot of players lose against it because they try to attack too hard too early.

have my own ideas in Caro Kann and still studying it.

ya that is very possible and it is what happened in my earlier games, but it can get boring sometimes