Playing against the engine at playstrategy.org
https://playstrategy.org/study/f3AH1wUw/vidrnXHm
Götterdämmerung - Twilight of the Gods
Sort:
I think the lack of a pawn-like piece (weak, slow, not good at offending other pieces from range, but able to defend each other in lines and get in the way of other pieces) is really problematic because it encourages a slugfest. I'm also not sure if Stockfish's evaluation is all that reliable on boards packed full of powerful pieces.
pds314 wrote:
I think the lack of a pawn-like piece (weak, slow, not good at offending other pieces from range, but able to defend each other in lines and get in the way of other pieces) is really problematic because it encourages a slugfest. I'm also not sure if Stockfish's evaluation is all that reliable on boards packed full of powerful pieces.
I agree. To my surprise, even Stockfish15 can't handle the evaluation of the positions that arise during the game. Try to analyze the game here or on lichess or play against a bot on playstrategy.org you will be surprised too 
The shortest game against PS-Random-Mover bot
#8 is currently the shortest path to victory against a weak bot.
Hey guys, join Götterdämmerung Club!
Daily Matches and much more! All games are unrated. The top clubs on this site want to play with us. Let's have some fun and enjoy the game!
https://www.chess.com/club/gotterdammerung
I like this variant, I think it's really exciting, at same time I want to input some friendly critics/questions.
I'm not a huge fan of the asymmetric setup -- or let's call it 'crossed symmetry' (like Thai Chess) as opposed to 'parallel symmetry' (like International Chess) -- and I cannot understand what is the added value of it. I tend to think in this variant it doesn't change much, so I'm not saying it is not good, but I'm rather asking what is the good of it?
Second thing, how do you are so confident saying the game is optimally balanced? I do not trust Stockfish evaluation on that matter, at least not at depth 20, if it was depth 40 or 60 then okay (maybe), but that would probably require some days or a week for a normal PC.
I tend to think White is ahead from the start, however the game is so complex that small inaccuracies can easily move the advantage from one player to the other. So in the end (probably) it is not very important who plays first just for that reason... I don't know if it is clear what I want to say.
Hello @samuelebeckis !
The question of symmetry and asymmetry in chess is very curious. We could write a whole book on this topic. The whole question rests on the even / odd game board. Playing on even boards will always be poorly balanced. Whatever arrangement we use. We can only slightly balance the forces by intelligently distributing the specific weight of the pieces on the board. The gravity of kings plays a special role.
It is difficult and long to explain, but you can understand with the help of visualization. For example:
compared to this
Where do you see a more balanced image?
This is why Makruk, Chu Shogi, and other even-board games use exactly this arrangement of kings.
On odd boards this problem does not exist.
Just perfect, agree.
Now about why I am so sure that the Götterdämmerung is optimally balanced. This is partly based on the evaluation of the engines, partly based on my experience and intuition, partly on the analysis of games played by this variation of chess. I do not propose to take my word for it, but to check everything in practice. And practice shows that the balance of white and black victories fluctuates strictly around 50%.
In games with complete information, the starting side will always have an advantage. There is no escape from this. However, we can always neutralize such an advantage, at least reduce it to a minimum, thanks to a well-thought-out initial arrangement, which takes into account the specific weight of each of the chess pieces.
Ah well, thanks for your answers my friend, I still keep my view on this part. From your examples: in the first setup White plays 1.Kc2 to gain space and opposition, in the second one White plays 1.Kb2 for the same reason, so they (virtually) result equally unbalanced.
I'd rather say: the parallel symmetry usually leads to more positional games, the crossed symmetry leads to more dynamics games. That setup is a little flaw of Makruk (for me, in my opinion) and one of the reason why I do prefer Shatranj.
Okay, I trust you on the near 50% winning ratio.
I agree on your last part, to be punctilious I'd like to mention a rare exception: in Dobutsu Shogi the first to play is at a disadvantage, due to pieces arrangement/ movements, and also the very small size of the board (3x4), the game begins in zugzwang! However is much more complex that what one can suppose.
The board size change things pretty much I think.
Twilight of the Gods
Night descends. The body of the deceased is carried to the castle in a solemn procession. Hagen and Gunther argue over the ring. Hagen mortally wounds Gunther, but when he tries to remove the ring from Siegfried's finger, the dead man's hand rises menacingly, and Hagen retreats in horror. Brunnhilde, tormented by remorse, removes the ring from Siegfried's hand in order to return it to the daughters of the Rhine. Then, jumping on a horse, she rushes into the fire, on which Siegfried's body is burned, blaming Wotan for his death ("Wie Sonne lauter"; "Like the sun, the beneficent face is clear"). The fire flares up, engulfing the castle. Hagen perishes in the waves of the overflowing Rhine. Fire reaches the heavens, Valhalla burns, the gods perish in flames. Evil redeemed. The Rhine returns to its shores. Mermaids frolic in its calm waves, playing with the ring.
The nightmare that takes place on the board is comparable to the agony of the gods in the last in a cycle of four musical dramas by Richard Wagner called "Der Ring des Nibelungen" -
"Götterdämmerung". Hence the name for this chess variant, which, in fact, is an adaptation of my Epic Chess to an 8x8 board. ( Epic Chess can be played online here:
www.evochess.com/ )
Let's see how we can beat the local engine Maximum(3200) in this unusual initial setup.
It's hard to believe, but on move 35 everything will be over for Black. So jump on a horse and rush into the fire!