[Rant] The Chess960 forum has been on a Downward Spiral.

There is that right enough. (I wasn't aware this was a site-wide issue; goes to show how much I use the forums.)

Instead of completely removing the window, one possible solution would be to require users to 'subscribe' to a certain forum in order to see what threads are being posted in. So, when someone makes a new account, they're not subscribed to any forum, and the Most Recent window doesn't show up/is empty. If a user were to subscribe to, say, the Chess Books & Equipment forum, they'd see the first 3, maybe 5 thread titles show up in the Most Recent window. They'd see things like, 'Shereshesky's Mastering the Endgame worth it?,' 'The Secret of Chess,' 'New (& cheaper) DGT e-board,' etc.. Below the title would be the original poster, the forum it has been posted in, and the time e.g. "Chess 2: The Sequel," new line, "Ebinola in Chess960 and Other Variants, 20 minutes ago"

Or, instead of having the window be on the side, have it be another page on the site where you can find the top threads for each forum you're subscribed to. You can search and sort by keywords, forums, or most recently posted in. If you're not subscribed to anything, you have no need for it. (Mostly) Out of sight, out of mind.

Let's also extend this to clubs, because clubs also have forums. If in the event a forum for play-by-forum games is not made, interested users can subscribe to certain clubs for certain variants, or you could have one big hub for these games instead. And I don't think it would be too congesting to make maybe one or two threads saying, 'Hey, this is our club for this variant, if you're interested, please join us here for games/discussion.' You could also drop a link in threads which explain the rules of the variant.

When a forum is made to separate these play-by-forum games from actual discussion, anyone is free to subscribe to said forum. If they're not interested, they're not interested, nothing that can be done about that.

And I'll say it again: It is not a matter of if a forum will be made, but when.

I saw a moderator post here yesterday, @MGleason, that's a rare sight. I would appreciate a member of staff's opinion on this.

First a technical point.

This forum topic has now been kicked into life, it now appears in the Most Recent list. 

It now ONLY takes one post to get it back into that list, the member @Ebinola posted one comment, topic straight into the list, been hanging in the list for 36 minutes as I type, not sure when it is going to drop off the list.

That is all that it takes now, once a topic has been flagged as HOT, not really sure how it gets flagged as HOT, but something to do with: number of members posting, number of actual posts, time span say 24 hours, blah, blah, blah.

Seems like once a topic is flagged as HOT it stays flagged as HOT to infinity and beyond...

Bump.

On the subject of CLUB FORUMS.

I first suggested this about 6 months ago, I think, but I was ignored.

I suggested this to the following groups of people:

Support

Moderators

Chess960 forum users (well maybe not, I forget, no point really)

I suggested to support and the moderators to allow ONE main topic in the Chess960 forum for each game, for bumping, sorry I mean...

Then have the club with the club forum topics for the actual games.

But it is not the complete solution, it is only part of the solution, you will still have a problem.

You will end up with a dozen or more MAIN CLUB TOPICS in the Chess960 forum and groups of people will still target those MAIN topics to get them into the advertising window, sorry I mean the Most Recent window.

I also suggested Club Forums to a moderator when I sent him a private message, on the first or second day after I returned once again to this website.

I think the most obvious problem with how threads are bumped is that the OP can bump his own post. Let me explain:

I don't know how it works on reddit, but on 4chan (and yes I'm aware this is a bizarre comparison), when you make a thread anyone who has an IP the same as the OP (You) cannot bump the thread. This is to prevent someone from spamming their thread so that it is always on the first page. Someone doing this would be called out by other users but it still has to be prevented. What's more, an anonymous user can optionally choose to NOT bump a thread by typing 'sage' into the options field. Of course, an anonymous imageboard is vastly different from a public forum; on 4chan, the users are anonymous, you make a thread, it gets replies, the thread eventually decays, it gets archived for a while, and it dies. On chess.com, a thread will always be bumped up to page 1, slot 1 when someone makes a post (and I'll demonstrate this later for sake of example). And old threads don't die, either. We've got a treasure trove of threads going all the way back to 2009.

Furthermore, on 4chan, every thread has a bump limit. Basically, when a thread's post number reaches a certain threshold (it differs from board to board depending on traffic), future posts no longer bump the thread. There was a problem with bumping back in August, where users would post but their threads would not be bumped. 

"So, Ebinola, what does 4chan have to do with chess.com?" You might wonder.

Well, if I may continue @W_A_R_L_O_R_D's point...

44 posts.

16 by @W_A_R_L_O_R_D.

14 by me.

4 by @ElephantHistorian.

3 by @hitthepin.

2 by @Martin0

1 by @vickalan.

1 by @JohnHS

3 other posts by people, I lost track tbqh.

This thread's popularity has been perpetuated for the most part by my own posts. This thread became 'hot' as soon as Page 3 of this thread was created. It's my belief that by allowing OPs to always bump their post back to page 1, the incentive of having your thread bumped by other people is watered down a little bit. Sure, you get a response from someone else, but you always have the opportunity to bump your thread back to Page 1. And this can make a thread's 'hotness' artificial rather than man-made.

Four changes that could be made so that bumping a thread is trickier:

1. The OP, posters who have the same IP as the OP, and other posters cannot bump a thread by doubleposting. This would rat out users who have multiple accounts (although anyone with a dynamic IP address easily gets around this, the same problem occurs on 4chan). The 'posters who have the same IP' bit applies to the IP address,es the 'OP and other posters' bit applies to the accounts. EDIT: This could also be lifted if the time gap between a doublepost is obvious enough to show that a user isn't spamming the thread (say, a week).
2. Threads should have a cooldown period scaled to how much activity the thread receives overall. 'Hot' threads should have a visual indicator to tell users if that particular thread is receiving a lot of activity as of late (like a flame). A thread on cool-down should also have a visual cue to tell users 'I'm on cooldown' (like an ice cube).
3. Users should have the option of choosing whether or not their post will bump up the thread. This could be a checkbox placed next to the 'Follow' one, and posts that do not bump the thread will not contribute to the thread's cooldown point.
4. After a long period of inactivity, or after a large post-count has been reached, a thread should be placed into permanent cooldown. Again, this should be scaled to how much activity the thread receives overall (Edited, my bad).  For a forum like this with not a lot of activity, the bump limit should be something like 150-200 posts, but the period of inactivity required to trigger permanent cooldown should be long. Furthermore, permanent cooldown prevents necrobumping (bumping an old thread) from happening.

Going back to the Most Recent window... Users should also have the option to filter threads that are 'hot' and threads that are in cooldown. That won't fix the problem of spamming but it would allow users that are sick of seeing the same threads in the Most Recent window over and over again to filter them out. Kind of like what you do when you block somebody. Don't want them in your thread? Don't want them PMing you over and over? Block them.

@Ebinola

Good move with blocking on a temporary basis man.

I was expecting arguments from my very first post, well done.

If anything it gave people the opportunity to think things over before posting.

If anything it gave people the opportunity to think things over and decide to NOT post in this topic.

I am not sure exactly why you decided to create another topic, I am reading it but I would prefer to stay in one place and avoid drifting about, I am a very focused person.

A comment of yours from your other topic made me laugh, I quote...

"If I make a stand on something, I am very stubborn, I won't change my stance on that so easily."

Must be that old SCOTS thing laddie, it is in our blood.

I made a stance TWO YEARS ago and I have not budged a single inch.

Aye

This is a wee test.

This topic dropped off the first page of the forum after 12 hours.

This was never the case in the past, the Chess960 forum was slow and steady.

In the past topics at the foot of the Chess960 forum could sit there for say 3 or 4 days.

But that was when it was a forum, it is no longer a forum and it has been this way for a long time now.

I am posting this to see if it gets into the Most Recent list, I think not.

I think that it may have "cooled" down, because yes, I am actually trying to treat it as a NORMAL topic.

No group of people here firing off one line comments in quick succession.

I have said this in the past and I am going to say it again.

This forum has been hijacked.

I know that YOU are watching everything.

I know that YOU are pulling all of the strings on this forum.

I know that YOU like staying in the shadows now, ever since you were banned from this website.

If YOU want to advertise whatever then you must PAY for REAL ADVERTISING.

I'm wondering if you ever talk about chess or chess variants? Wanna play a game of Chess on an Infinite Plane?

Don't you ever get tired man?

With all the shift work that you do on this forum.

I take that as you don't talk chess, nor will play a chess-variant game.

I used to post about chess variants on this forum, but then I stopped.

You see it is no longer a forum, it is a promotional platform.

Here’s the biggest part of the problem: @vickalan, you’re the biggest perpetuator of these threads (no secret) but I really don’t know whether or not you realise there’s a problem.

On the one hand, your posts could be interpreted as: You’re really naive about the whole thing and have no awareness of the problem. Like, an autistic naivety. Not an insult, I have experienced this myself in the past.

On the other hand, your posts could be interpreted as: You’re fully aware that there’s a problem and choose to do nothing about it. You might even AGREE with some of the points made in this thread; but no, better to keep exposure, no point in owing up, better to paint anyone who’s not in favour of these threads as ‘meandering.’ After all, everyone has to have a public view and a private view.

I’d like to think you’re the former - that it’s going to take some time before you realise, “Hang on, there is a problem, I’ve got to do something about it.” 

But if you’re really the latter...? That would be very sinister.

So please, put up an argument. Most who participate in these threads have made a few fair points. I just have two questions: What is the primary function of a public internet forum; how is content generated? And What do these threads do for not just this forum in particular, but for the entire site? 

Here’s something that may explain the creeping normality of play-by-forum threads.

There’s a psychological phenomenon known as the ‘Mere-Exposure effect,’ where people develop preferences for familiar things. This is what allows brands, icons, and, quite bizarrely, internet memes, to spread like wildfire. Why? If you repeat it enough, people will like it. The more people that are exposed early on, the faster it will spread. Most internet memes become memes due to two factors - exposure and repetition. 

I understand the positions of @Ebinola and @W_A_R_L_O_R_D and I am also against advertising or spam in the forum.

Nevertheless, I think it is right when games are played here with new chess variants and not only discussed in theory about chess variants.

For example, I discovered Infinite Chess through @vickalan, or Psychologic Chess, which I played with @cobra91. If such games were banned, it would be very repressive and totalitarian.

It's not really about trying to suppress content here @McGoohan, it's about getting people to realise that play-by-forum threads in this forum choke the flow of discussion on this forum, because the way that they work goes against the purpose and function of this forum.

Which is why the solution (for now) is for people to push for a place where people can play variants all they like. We will have the discussion here, the playing elsewhere. When that's done, we can focus on the bigger issue: the Most Recent window, which affects not only this part of the site but everywhere else as well. I think I've got some pretty good solutions for the window - make it a subscriber list rather than something that shows the most popular threads.

I sent a request to a member of staff () who was here not long ago.

He hasn't responded, but give him time.

You might also notice that Dr. Haddad and I are continuing a game on @ElephantHistorian's site. He has acknowledged the problem, and thinks (and I hope you don't mind me saying this) 'there are too many threads of games polluting the quality of the site. In my opinion these games should be in another forum dedicated for that.'  

He has also offered a place for people to play these games, on his site.

I'll say it yet again: it is not a matter of if a forum will be created but when. We don't want a forum, we need a forum, sooner rather than later.

People have been suggesting another forum for half a year now, but it's all talk, no action.

I am action. And I get things done.

A picture they say is worth a thousand words. That wee Pawn has more than one meaning, a reference to the mods is just one of them, you can figure out the rest, I will not explain.

I am no longer in contact with the mods or support, I have had my say and I will leave it at that, this matter is no longer my concern.

The forums have been, how shall I say this, an "interesting" experience.

I do not see anything changing quickly and quite frankly I have lost interest in, well, everything,

It is not complicated, remove the most recent window.

Why shoot crocodiles when you can drain the swamp.