Even simple knight vs bishop actually has helpmate possibilities for the bishop side it seems
Two knight vs bishop helpmate?
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May 19, 2022
0
#3
I believe chess.com uses forced mate with the condition that you must be able to checkmate without the help of your opponent's pieces. Aka two knights vs pawn is ruled as a draw, etc. etc. Don't quote me on that though.
The side with a pawn wins if their opponent has no time. Period. One piece no pawns draw. Two knights versus an army on the board .. win .. two knights vs one piece . Win . It doesn't matter what the position is. I once left my opponent with two knights and Wala it was lost. So you gotta clear the pawns and make sure they only have one light piece for the draw
#1
"in this endgame, if the side with the two kights runs out of time is it a win or draw?
is there any helpmate style position where the lone bishop can mate with this imbalance?"
Laws of Chess:
"6.9
Except where one of Articles 5.1.1, 5.1.2, 5.2.1, 5.2.2, 5.2.3 applies, if a player does not complete the prescribed number of moves in the allotted time, the game is lost by that player.
However, the game is drawn if the position is such that the opponent cannot checkmate the player’s king by any possible series of legal moves."
https://handbook.fide.com/chapter/E012018
In KNN vs. KB both sides have a series of legal moves that lead to checkmate,
so whoever runs out of time loses.
There are generally three different rule sets involved.
1) FIDE (cited above) K+2N vs K+B the flagging side loses (for that matter, K+N vs K+B the flagging side loses). Material the can win on time against a bare king are K+P, K+R, K+Q, K+B+N, K+2B(different color squares), K+2N. Blocked/unwinnable positions (such as Black Ke8, Pb5, Pd5, Pg5, White Ke1, Pb4, Pd4, Pg5) are a draw regardless of flagging. If the position is not blocked then any helpmate can win.
2) US Chess K+2N vs K+P the flagging side loses. K+2N vs K+B (or K+N vs K+B) the flagging side only loses if mate is forced. Material that can win on time against a bare king are the same a FIDE except K+2N is only a win if forced. Blocked/unwinnable positions are a draw regardless of flagging. If the position is not blocked then any forced mate can win and any material that would win against a bare king can win.
3) Chess.com assumes the opponent has a bare king and then checks to see if there is enough material to win (P and/or R and/or Q and/or 2B<opposite color squares> and/or B+N - I don't remember is 2N is considered enough but a lone B or a lone N is not enough). Thus K+N or K+B cannot win on time even if there is a forced win (the opponent's pieces that might smother the king are disregarded). For that matter, the above mentioned totally blocked position can be won on time on Chess.com even though FIDE and US Chess would consider it a draw.
May 28, 2022
0
#8
jetoba wrote:
There are generally three different rule sets involved.
1) FIDE (cited above) K+2N vs K+B the flagging side loses (for that matter, K+N vs K+B the flagging side loses). Material the can win on time against a bare king are K+P, K+R, K+Q, K+B+N, K+2B(different color squares), K+2N. Blocked/unwinnable positions (such as Black Ke8, Pb5, Pd5, Pg5, White Ke1, Pb4, Pd4, Pg5) are a draw regardless of flagging. If the position is not blocked then any helpmate can win.
2) US Chess K+2N vs K+P the flagging side loses. K+2N vs K+B (or K+N vs K+B) the flagging side only loses if mate is forced. Material that can win on time against a bare king are the same a FIDE except K+2N is only a win if forced. Blocked/unwinnable positions are a draw regardless of flagging. If the position is not blocked then any forced mate can win and any material that would win against a bare king can win.
3) Chess.com assumes the opponent has a bare king and then checks to see if there is enough material to win (P and/or R and/or Q and/or 2B<opposite color squares> and/or B+N - I don't remember is 2N is considered enough but a lone B or a lone N is not enough). Thus K+N or K+B cannot win on time even if there is a forced win (the opponent's pieces that might smother the king are disregarded). For that matter, the above mentioned totally blocked position can be won on time on Chess.com even though FIDE and US Chess would consider it a draw.
very thorough thank you!
May 28, 2022
0
#9
tygxc wrote:
#1
"in this endgame, if the side with the two kights runs out of time is it a win or draw?
is there any helpmate style position where the lone bishop can mate with this imbalance?"
Laws of Chess:
"6.9
Except where one of Articles 5.1.1, 5.1.2, 5.2.1, 5.2.2, 5.2.3 applies, if a player does not complete the prescribed number of moves in the allotted time, the game is lost by that player.
However, the game is drawn if the position is such that the opponent cannot checkmate the player’s king by any possible series of legal moves."
https://handbook.fide.com/chapter/E012018
In KNN vs. KB both sides have a series of legal moves that lead to checkmate,
so whoever runs out of time loses.
thank you for the positions
in this endgame, if the side with the two kights runs out of time is it a win or draw? is there any helpmate style position where the lone bishop can mate with this imbalance?