Do timed-tactic problems actually help a beginner like me?

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Avatar of EscherehcsE
s23bog wrote:
EscherehcsE wrote:
s23bog wrote:

What is the most complicated and interesting game you have ever played?  How many moves?  Can you imagine playing a game that was 1000's of moves long?

Wut?

What was I not clear about?

Everything. Your post seems to have nothing to do with the theme of the thread.

Avatar of EscherehcsE
s23bog wrote:

Isn't the theme of the thread chess?

No, the theme of this thread is whether timed tactics problems help beginners. I'd recommend that you make your initial post in a new thread instead of attempting to hijack this thread.

Avatar of VincenzoPancotti
 
Amanda2018 wrote:

hello,


been playing for about 6 months and it seems like digging deeper into a position would be time better spent for a beginner (like ME) than quickly finding something that works?   i mean, isn't that the opposite of finding the “best” move?  when solving a position… shouldn’t we look deeply for the best move?  quickly finding a move seems like i'am using intuition more than calculating ability?  my goal is learning to solve positions in OTB games (not blitz)  it feels like timed-tactic drills are leading me in the wrong direction?  am i missing something? …i usually do:)


tnx 4 any ideas


I'd definitely agree with the general opinion already posted to this thread.. don't use the timer at this point. General observations:

  1. You've started as a young adult; this means you won't progress as rapidly as a child who learns at the age of 5 or 6, and so you shouldn't beat yourself up over not having won a game yet. The good news is that if you practice and apply yourself in the right way, you will improve and (very important!) have some fun doing it. Smile
  2. If I've understood things correctly, you've been playing OTB so we can't see any of your games to date. My first question to you would be: are you losing games just by dropping pieces? That is to say, you lose pieces just because you didn't notice they were attacked?

If that's the case, then *before* trying to solve tactics problems you should concentrate on not dropping pieces! The Novice Nook articles contain some good "mental checklists" to go through before you move, which will really help here.

The "Step-by-step" method (originally from the Netherlands but now available in English too) stresses this heavily - learn to walk first (not dropping pieces) before you try to run (worry about two-move and three-move tactics)

Once you've sorted that out (or if you already have, in which case congratulations) then use tactical exercises to learn patterns *and* to practice how to think in a disciplined way. Since you play OTB, I would recommend you set up the test position on your board and try to solve it there, as if it were a real game. This will encourage you to try and think through the whole solution before moving pieces, rather than grab-and-guess which is all to tempting to do in the browser.

If you get stuck on a position and can't find the answer, put it to one side and make a note to come back to it later. Take a screenshot or whatever you find convenient. Then move onto another one. Try to resist the temptation to "give up and click for the answer". Get the friends you play with to try the problem and if they work it out, they can give you better (as in more subtle) hints than the programs can. By working the exercises into your social OTB play you will hopefully find them more of a pleasure and less of a chore.

I could go on but it would start to get off-topic (if I haven't already Smile)

Good luck and enjoy your chess!

Avatar of EscherehcsE
s23bog wrote:
EscherehcsE wrote:
s23bog wrote:

Isn't the theme of the thread chess?

No, the theme of this thread is whether timed tactics problems help beginners. I'd recommend that you make your initial post in a new thread instead of attempting to hijack this thread.

How about you worry about what you say and where, and I will worry about what I say and where?

If someone wants to violate the forum rules, I can't stop him; Only a moderator can do that. (Well, the OP could block you from making further posts, but that's also not within my capabilities.) I've given you the rule, if you want to flaunt it, be my guest. It's no skin off my nose, although the OP might be irked, since it's her thread.

Avatar of roscoepwavetrain

"tactics time" is a great book, i've played thru both volumes for a total of 2000 problems. single best thing i've done to improve my ability. 

Avatar of Shakaali

I haven't red all the previous answers so may be repeating what's already been said, but I'll voice my opinion anyway.

  • Forget the timer. In fact, if you use the tactics trainer on this site, go to the TT settings and uncheck the box "Show Timer".
  • Use as much time for each problem as you feel necessary. Having said that, as a beginner you should be mostly doing quick problems where calculating one or two lines few moves deep is enough. The goal should be to learn to recognize the basic tactical patterns and the most efficient way to do this is to by solving lots of "easy" problems. You want to drill the same patterns over and over again until they become automatic.
  • Don't spend too much time on a problem you cannot solve. Study the solution carefully (it may contain a new pattern) and move into next problem.
  • TT is great for a tournament player who already knows the basics and wants to keep tactics sharp but for a beginner a more structured approach might be preferable (In particular, concentrating on one particular tactical theme at a time). There are books, training DVD's and online courses available for that.
  • Playing lot is more important than solving exercises! Early on tactics training mostly gives you tools. You still have to learn how to apply these tools in a game situation. In fact, if you keep dropping pieces because of missing one move threats, knowledge of a smothered mate won't be of much use.
Avatar of VLaurenT
Amanda2018 wrote:

hello,


been playing for about 6 months and it seems like digging deeper into a position would be time better spent for a beginner (like ME) than quickly finding something that works?   i mean, isn't that the opposite of finding the “best” move?  when solving a position… shouldn’t we look deeply for the best move?  quickly finding a move seems like i'am using intuition more than calculating ability?  my goal is learning to solve positions in OTB games (not blitz)  it feels like timed-tactic drills are leading me in the wrong direction?  am i missing something? …i usually do:)


tnx 4 any ideas


There are at least two different skills involved in finding tactics in chess positions :

  • pattern recognition (spotting in some way that the pieces could produce a known tactic - eg. Bc2/Qd2 - if I move Qd2-d3 and my opponent has castled kingside, I threaten a checkmate on h7 - the B/Q battery being a known pattern)
  • calculation of variations : "if I do this, he does that, then I do this, he does that, I win a pawn and I evaluate the situation as clearly advantageous for me"

Pattern recognition doesn't rely on calculation : it's just things you already know popping up in your brain. A bit like the words you pick in your natural language : you don't have to think about them to complete a sentence like : "I'm going to school and will stay at Amanda's this [evening/week-end]"

However, calculation somewhat relies on pattern recognition (but not only), as the patterns you identify as you calculate help guide your calculations (eg. you try to make some checkmating combinations work).

Back to your question, in general it's better to spend some reasonable time trying to solve puzzles, as you need to look around to find relevant elements in the position. However, quick solving could be used to develop pattern recognition, by browsing through simple and related problems (eg. a set of back-rank mates for example). TT on chess.com is not the best tool to do this though.

Good luck with your chess. And keep your independant way of thinking, whatever you read in these forums ! Smile

Avatar of Bulacano

The logic behind using a timer is that stronger players will not only solve tactics of a certain level more accurately than weaker players, but that they will also come up with the solution faster. The purpose really is so that the stronger players aren't stuck doing 100 simple puzzles when they want to be challenged. Your question is framed such that the timer, rather than the position, is the concern. Ignore the timer.

Avatar of Samaritaine

In the mean time it's kind of vital you start Laughing Play a game, do a tactic! Make mistakes, it's fine. MOre fun too. Never mind all the wonderful books, and well meant advice. If you don't do anything, what good is it all?  You have a Diamond membership. Use it!

Avatar of fennicus

I agree with Samaritaine that it is vital you start playing. I've played thousands of games of chess on this site and on others and I've lost most of them. It is only after having played (and lost) all of those games that I am beginning to recognize patterns and positions/see possible tactics/avoid blunders/have an idea of what my opponent will do. The fact that you mentioned your comfort zone at all tells me that you know what you must do...NOW GO GET 'EM!