How to win a won game?

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kleong12

I, as a 2060 rated player, often get into +3 to +5 positions against 2100-2300 USCF rated players and lose my advantage, leading to a draw or loss. It’s not like I blunder the whole game away (although I’ve had my fair share of these), it’s more like not playing the critical line and making several inaccuracies. I wouldn’t hesitate to play the critical moves against lower rateds, but I seem to play too conservatively against higher rateds. So how should I prevent these inaccuracies and keep up the pressure?

tygxc

If you lose a +3 position, then that is no inaccuracy, that is a blunder (??).
"The hardest game to win is a won game" - Lasker
Always check your intended move is no blunder before you play it.
"He who has a slight disadvantage plays more attentively, inventively and more boldly than his antagonist who either takes it easy or aspires after too much. " - Lasker
"When you sit down to play a game you should think only about the position, but not about the opponent." - Capablanca


kleong12
tygxc wrote:

If you lose a +3 position, then that is no inaccuracy, that is a blunder (??).
"The hardest game to win is a won game" - Lasker
Always check your intended move is no blunder before you play it.
"He who has a slight disadvantage plays more attentively, inventively and more boldly than his antagonist who either takes it easy or aspires after too much. " - Lasker
"When you sit down to play a game you should think only about the position, but not about the opponent." - Capablanca


I said that I make several inaccuracies, not a blunder. Thanks for the advice though. I think the second and third quotes appeal to me more.

tygxc

#3
Inaccuracies do not exist.
If a move does not change the game state from "won" to "draw", then the move is not inaccurate.
If a move changes the game state from "won" to "draw", then it is a mistake (?), not an inaccuracy.
Whenever you have a won position and later it becomes a draw or even a loss, it is always possible to pinpoint a single move as the culprit: the mistake (?) that threw away the win.

chessplayer109485
tygxc wrote:

#3
Inaccuracies do not exist.
If a move does not change the game state from "won" to "draw", then the move is not inaccurate.
If a move changes the game state from "won" to "draw", then it is a mistake (?), not an inaccuracy.
Whenever you have a won position and later it becomes a draw or even a loss, it is always possible to pinpoint a single move as the culprit: the mistake (?) that threw away the win.

Maybe that's true in a higher chess sense, but for actual OTB play it is not good advice. To kleong, I would recommend trying to understand why you making the mistakes. If it is because you played in the wrong manner, then maybe try to think of why you are better during the game. If you understand why you are better and are failing to find the right move at critical moments, then you could try to train calculation.

alphaous
tygxc wrote:

#3
Inaccuracies do not exist.
If a move does not change the game state from "won" to "draw", then the move is not inaccurate.
If a move changes the game state from "won" to "draw", then it is a mistake (?), not an inaccuracy.
Whenever you have a won position and later it becomes a draw or even a loss, it is always possible to pinpoint a single move as the culprit: the mistake (?) that threw away the win.

He's talking about a series of moves, such as a wrong plan, that change the game to a draw. Often times there is no one culprit, but rather one move that makes the win harder, then another that makes the position holdable, then another that makes it a dead draw, and it's hard to pinpoint exactly what went wrong until you check with an engine and it tells you that a series of 3 moves each lost you 1 point of advantage. In that case, it was not one blunder, but a couple of moves that would not have blown the advantage on their own, and that's what makes some wins tricky at higher levels.

alphaous

Lol, unless you're a triple-digit player. 

chuddog

Show a couple examples. That will make it much easier to give relevant advice.

 

Separately, I have a little room in my schedule if you are interested in professional coaching. Your level and types of problems are very much in my specialization. 

aanval22

I'll add to that: Recently I got a +2 position out of the opening in an OTB game against an IM, then threw it away by making a questionable exchange sac without giving it too much thought, and then playing poorly after that. The moral of the story is to put time into conversion, if you find the right moves things will be easier.

kleong12

Here's a couple examples in the National Online Quick this weekend against NM's:

Against NM Vladyslav Shevkunov

https://lichess.org/BUtPMu71/white#100

Against NM Joseph Levine

https://lichess.org/4q3Z5f8RKxpG

 

chuddog

Can you explain, in your own words, why you were winning in those games and what you missed? The engine evals make it look simpler than it really is. Have you analyzed the games yourself?

alphaous

I know I'm a patzer/CM (Choke Master) but I think you made it too hard on yourself in the first game. You had a chance to take on f6 and force favorable trades where you would have been up 1-2 pawns, but you tried a complex bisho maneuver instead, and after that the moves didn't seem so natural.

kleong12
chuddog wrote:

Can you explain, in your own words, why you were winning in those games and what you missed? The engine evals make it look simpler than it really is. Have you analyzed the games yourself?

Game 1: Froze the opponent’s queenside, got a dominant knight on c4 and a strong pawn on e5. Eventually won a pawn and killed the opponent’s dark-squared bishop’s activity.

I missed exf6 followed by Nd6 and Re4, netting a huge advantage. I also missed that my a5 pawn was hanging later in the game.

 

Game 2: 

Attained a space advantage on the kingside as the opponent’s pieces were paralyzed on the queenside. With fewer pieces on the board, this is decisive.

I missed f5 (after Kf7) followed by Bf4 and Re7+, and I missed the amazing ...Ne5! from my opponent. I also hesitated to play f5 later, drawing the game because his knight is rendered ineffective.

alphaous

Ne5 was a cool move, that looks easy to miss.

Chessking4640
kleong12 wrote:

Here's a couple examples in the National Online Quick this weekend against NM's:

Against NM Vladyslav Shevkunov

https://lichess.org/BUtPMu71/white#100

Against NM Joseph Levine

https://lichess.org/4q3Z5f8RKxpG

 

that joesph levine swindled me 2 in ICC -_-

Chessking4640

try to understand what your opponents are trying to do always be more alert (especially when your winning) never allow counter play 

noraa8

kleong just sucks lol imagine not winning +3 positions -_=

if u can't tell im joking

Steven-ODonoghue
Optimissed wrote:

Much as I repect him, I regard Capablanca as wrong, regarding not playing the player.

Agreed.

In my opinion, "play the board, not the player" is one of the dumbest and most harmful peices of chess advice that is given out. maybe on par with "always check, it might be mate".

one of my favourite books "Chess for tigers" has a whole chapter dedicated to why you should "play the man, not the board". 

Wins
kleong12 wrote:

I, as a 2060 rated player, often get into +3 to +5 positions against 2100-2300 USCF rated players and lose my advantage, leading to a draw or loss. It’s not like I blunder the whole game away (although I’ve had my fair share of these), it’s more like not playing the critical line and making several inaccuracies. I wouldn’t hesitate to play the critical moves against lower rateds, but I seem to play too conservatively against higher rateds. So how should I prevent these inaccuracies and keep up the pressure?

I may be much lower rated than you but I normally try to trade off material.

m9829018

I won many games with -2/-3 sometimes with more disadvantage. But that's not always the case. Important thing is that how did that imbalances happen? Under your control? Opponent won them by playing his own plan? this is important.

You need to shape the game in your way, you need to be in driverseat.. as much as possible. If you are losing the game you should lose it because "you" did something wrong. By this way you can have a chance to fix it later.

Most games i lost, i lost them because i didn't have idea what to do. Opponent outplayed me strategically. He shaped the game, many of my moves were like forced moves. Whatever i did wrong, i did it in the very beginning phases.. and i couldnt foresee some results. and it was too late when i realized it.

So all in all, control means more than a few points. you can sac your queen and win the game with -9 you know. find your weakness, understand where you stop talking and start listening.. if you know what i mean.