Impossible to Checkmate!

ChessNetwork

From a standard chess game, what is the greatest # of points 1 player can have and it be impossible to mate? 
(Let the King=0, Queen=9, Rook=5, Bishop=3, Knight=3 & Pawn=1 for this question)

Mac10688
[COMMENT DELETED]
IWTCIRD

3. Bishop or Knight + King

i know you can't force mate with two knights, but that doen't meant it's impossible 

cjb21

39 

ChessNetwork

cjb21

It's true that it's impossible to try to checkmate if a side is in stalemate. Similarly it's impossible to try to checkmate if a side is in checkmate.

Let's assume the game has not ended.

Frootloop2

8? What do you mean impossible: not-forced mate or no mate even if they want to get mated?

Scottrf

27?

9 bishops of the same colour.

llamalord42

Does this count impossible or highly improbable positions, such as multiple same colored bishops? What about positions in which next move no matter what it will be stalemate? Are you asking for quiescent positions?

piphilologist

52

this is definitely not the maximum as I can see a way to get more

PLAVIN81

Not imposible but higly impobable

GeniusKJ

9 same colored bishops - 27

shoopi

103. Though theoretically speaking, this game has pretty much ended, as there can only be one result, a draw. If this still fails to meet the desired requirements, perhaps op should be more specific about the requirements.

shengyi

Interesting topic. Depends on interpretation of the question.

p-wnattack

Alext190
Frootloop2 wrote:

8? What do you mean impossible: not-forced mate or no mate even if they want to get mated?

 

That's not valid, as the position you showed isn't impossible to be checkmated. It's a forced mate in 152 or less. Yes, seriously.

chessplayer11

The question implies that you can be checkmated on the next move, therefore it would be impossible to mate, thus the answer would be 103 if the other side allows all of your pawns to queen and both of you move to a position where mate would be impossible on the next move for that side either via stalemate, or the king being checkmated.



Frootloop2
Alext190 wrote: 

That's not valid, as the position you showed isn't impossible to be checkmated. It's a forced mate in 152 or less. Yes, seriously.

black just moves between an available square and h8. White can't reach h8 to force black out, and he can't cutoff the available squares without stalemate. right?

piphilologist
shoopi wrote:

103. Though theoretically speaking, this game has pretty much ended, as there can only be one result, a draw. If this still fails to meet the desired requirements, perhaps op should be more specific about the requirements.

 

not "pretty much" ended; the game has ended due to FIDE rules 5.2b and 9.6

5.2 b. The game is drawn when a position has arisen in which neither player can checkmate the opponent’s king with any series of legal moves. The game is said to end in a ‘dead position’. This immediately ends the game, provided that the move producing the position was legal. (See Article 9.6)

9.6

The game is drawn when a position is reached from which a checkmate cannot occur by any possible series of legal moves. This immediately ends the game, provided that the move producing this position was legal.

So therefore a checkmate must still be possible; otherwise the game has already ended. If white cannot possibly checkmate then Black must be able to checkmate white. This means almost all of the positions in this thread up to now have been incorrect.

chessplayer11
piphilologist wrote:

This means almost all of the positions in this thread up to now have been incorrect.

Hey. I hope you don't mean mine. I gave a complete move list. Laughing

 

And no, he said it pretty much has ended, which was true. It was white's turn and any move would have resulted in a stalemate. As white still had one more move, it was "pretty much" over, but not quite yet. So you're last statement is just incorrect.

piphilologist
chessplayer11 wrote:
piphilologist wrote:

This means almost all of the positions in this thread up to now have been incorrect.

Hey. I hope you don't mean mine. I gave a complete move list.

 

And no, he said it pretty much has ended, which was true. It was white's turn and any move would have resulted in a stalemate. As white still had one more move, it was "pretty much" over, but not quite yet. So you're last statement is just incorrect.

No, the game had already ended. Read the rules of chess.

5.2 b. The game is drawn when a position has arisen in which neither player can checkmate the opponent’s king with any series of legal moves. The game is said to end in a ‘dead position’. This immediately ends the game, provided that the move producing the position was legal. 

Also your post was incorrect as the game was already over in a checkmate. And according to post 6 the game must not be already over.

But anyway here is a correct 103. All white moves stalemate black except for 1.Ng2?? hxg2# losing. As it is possible for black to checkmate white this is not a dead position.

edit:whoops Rg3... let me fix that

edit2: I can't seem to get it without using 3 knights which puts the points down to 97 :( see if someone else can get 103