...Thanks.... but there's nothing to do that could win or at least draw?
Is there anything Black can do here?
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Well not unless white helps you out, he's a piece up for nothing. And you have doubled pawns and he will probably win the bishop pair.
No, I dont think so. Even if you weren't a piece down, you're so cramped you're gonna get overrun soon. JUst for interest, I plugged this into Stockfish, which evaluates as almost +7, so white can drop 2 pieces and stll be ahead.
rooperi wrote:
No, I dont think so. Even if you weren't a piece down, you're so cramped you're gonna get overrun soon. JUst for interest, I plugged this into Stockfish, which evaluates as almost +7, so white can drop 2 pieces and stll be ahead.
Are you sure? Seems unlikely, I think the chess.com computer evaluates a pawn advantage as +2 i.e. double counts.
Don't forget the OP said it was Black to move.
OldHastonian wrote:
Don't forget the OP said it was Black to move.
Unless he gets 2 moves I don't think that matters.
My bad, I had White to move. But with Black to move, it still gives +6.14 at 20 ply.
rooperi wrote:
My bad, I had White to move. But with Black to move, it still gives +6.14 at 20 ply.
Take off two white pieces, I really don't think it would be even. I think +6 basically means up a piece.
I'm using Stockfish, in Scid. +1 means 1 pawn advantage.
Take off the knight and bishop on the back rank then, does it give an even evaluation? I don't agree in the slightest with your summary that white can drop 2 pieces and still be ahead.
Oct 30, 2012
0
#12
Aw well, at least he missed it and I was able to chug out a win :) It took a lot out of me, though. I've played very few games that have run over 50 minutes. Next time, though, I know that I should be more careful. You live and you learn :)
It is possible to draw when a whole minor piece down - as for example if you manage to exchange all the other pieces and all the other pawns. By itself the minor piece cannot combine with a king to deliver mate. But it is extremely unlikely that your opponent will play so tamely as to allow that. He will happily simplify until he has one piece plus some pawns and you have some pawns but then he will attack one of your pawns with his king and his piece and you can only defend it once with your king so the pawn falls and then he does the same again and then he queens one of the extra pawns.
There are also positions that can arise where the side lacking one piece can manage to construct a fortress with their pieces and pawns and the king then sits inside the fortress just moving back and forth and the person with the extra material cannot break into the fortress w/o giving up material such that the game would swing back to or towards equality of material. But this is rare - I have never set up such a fortress or seen one set up by an opponent or by a player in a game I was kibbitzing.
Other than these cases one whole minor piece down with no compensation at all means losing unless your opponent blunders. Hence pfren's comment.
Why do you have no compensation for the piece? Well look at the position. Where on the board is there some opportunity for black to exploit? The white king is safely tucked out of easy reach; none of the white pieces are attacked; the white pawns can all move to defend each other and to keep you at bay; and so on. The one and only thing I can see that black has which is not equally matched by white is that one of black's rooks looks out along a half open file. But it does not look out onto a critical part of the board and all it can see out there is a well defended, mobile pawn.
In fact for the reasons given above black's position is slightly worse than white's (leaving the absent piece out of account).
Playing a casual game I might play on: just to see how my opponent got on in demonstrating his win; and hoping for a miracle. In an otb game for my club I would not insult my opponent. I would take pfren's good advice.
chessman1504 wrote:
...Thanks.... but there's nothing to do that could win or at least draw?
Nothing that black can do, no. If white gives a enough pieces back then black could win or draw. As it is black is completely dead :p
It's not just the piece down, the pieces you do have left wont be able to get organized any time soon. In this position it's as bad as another two pawns down or so.
If you're playing against beginners though might as well keep playing.
Oct 30, 2012
0
#15
waffllemaster wrote:
chessman1504 wrote:
...Thanks.... but there's nothing to do that could win or at least draw?
Nothing that black can do, no. If white gives a enough pieces back then black could win or draw. As it is black is completely dead :p
It's not just the piece down, the pieces you do have left wont be able to get organized any time soon. In this position it's as bad as another two pawns down or so.
If you're playing against beginners though might as well keep playing.
Yep, it's a lost position.
@IMpfren:..... Thanks, I'll consider it....
pfren wrote:
You can do many things here. The best one by far seems resigning.
Are you sure you didn't set this position up? No one, not even a beginner would make moves to create this position for Black!
Oct 30, 2012
0
#18
Well, I didn't get into this specific position... this is what would have happened had my opponent found the hanging bishop. It would have happened after move 10 of this gamehttp://www.chess.com/livechess/game?id=387895846
Hello,
I recently finished a game, and I think it might be the best game I've ever played in my short chess "career." However, I noticed that in the opening I made a fatal error... I left a bishop hanging, and my position would have been compromised had my opponent found it. I was wondering.. what can Black (me) do here? This is what the position would have looked like had my opponent found the hanging bishop (It says White to move; it's actually Black to move)