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Studying openings is highly UNDERrated!

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pfren
IM pfren
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Aug 28, 2015
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#61
ponz111 wrote:

masters have not memorized 100,000 opening moves. It is a little silly to say this.

Apparently he was hidden in a master's closet while he was studying, and saw it all.

madhacker
madhacker
Aug 28, 2015
0
#62
ipcress12 wrote:

I remember Simon Williams or Andrew Martin pointing out that the objective of chess is to checkmate the king, not to reach a favorable endgame -- or a playable middlegame for that matter.

Yes, although the latter two are valid means to achieving the ultimate goal. I tend to think about it like this:

The objective in the opening is to kill the b--tard, or failing that, to reach a decent middlegame. In which, the objective is to kill the b--tard, or failing that, to reach a decent endgame. In which, the objective is to kill the b--tard, or failing that, to survive.

Salvator_Mundi
Salvator_Mundi
Aug 28, 2015
0
#63

I pray that "kill the b--tard" is the same as checkmate the enemy king.

VLaurenT
VLaurenT
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Aug 28, 2015
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#64

I find it hard to believe that IM may have 100,000 opening moves memorized, but maybe some IMs can tell us :-)

pfren
IM pfren
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Aug 28, 2015
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#65

More likely having 100,000 beers consumed while analysing... Tongue Out

SmyslovFan
SmyslovFan
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Aug 28, 2015
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#66
ipcress12 wrote:

Smyslov: It would have been helpful if you had included that summary in your original post.

I almost never click a link unless I have a good idea of what I'm clicking to and specfically why I might find it interesting.

Yes, I realize people need to be spoon-fed.

It was Nigel Short who said,

“Modern Chess is too much concerned with things like Pawn structure. Forget it, Checkmate ends the game”


SmyslovFan
SmyslovFan
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Aug 28, 2015
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#67
pfren wrote:

More likely having 100,000 beers consumed while analysing...

First of all, read the article.

Secondly, consider all the opening threads that Pfren has commented on. He not only knows many thousands of opening positions, he has opinions on them too.

ponz111
ponz111
Aug 28, 2015
0
#68

Masters do not not have 100,000 opening moves memorized. Especially if you do not count the same moves twice.

examples

1. e4  e5  2. Nf3  Nc6  3. Bb5

1. e4  e5  2. Nf3  Nc6  3. d4

 

These should count as 6 moves  do not count 1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 twice

Then  1. e4  e5  2. Nf3  Nc6  3. Bb5  a6  counts as only 1 extra move or a total of 7  moves memorized for the 3 variations.

No way you are going to get to 100,000.

Masters remember the ideas behind the openings as well as many of the  opening moves 

ponz111
ponz111
Aug 28, 2015
0
#69
bb_gum234 wrote:
SmyslovFan wrote:
pfren wrote:

More likely having 100,000 beers consumed while analysing...

First of all, read the article.

Secondly, consider all the opening threads that Pfren has commented on. He not only knows many thousands of opening positions, he has opinions on them too.

Just an observation. Many times (even when I was rated much lower) I'd put a game into my computer and discover we'd played theory (good or bad) for 10 moves.

Masters being able to play 100,000 theoretical moves, whether they know them or can find them OTB, seems to be what the study suggests. And although it's not worth much, to say it this way sounds much more believable.

This is one of the points.

TheOldReb
NM TheOldReb
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Aug 28, 2015
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#70
pfren wrote:

More likely having 100,000 beers consumed while analysing...

This is shocking ! I thought greeks were more wine drinkers than beer ?  Am I wrong pfren ?  Another stereotype shattered perhaps ?  Surprised

Pulpofeira
Pulpofeira
Aug 28, 2015
0
#71

Beer is everywhere. But yes, at least my wife uses exclusively olive oil for cooking...

TheGreatOogieBoogie
TheGreatOogieBoogie
Aug 28, 2015
0
#72

Even bad openings can yield good results against great players, but don't bet on it in general:





Eseles
Eseles
Aug 28, 2015
0
#73
Reb wrote:
pfren wrote:

More likely having 100,000 beers consumed while analysing...

This is shocking ! I thought greeks were more wine drinkers than beer ?  Am I wrong pfren ?  Another stereotype shattered perhaps ?  

yeah...

Greeks still drink lots of wine, but it was probably more popular some decades ago...

especially during the summertime, a cold beer is "a must", i've personally had 2 bottles of wine this summer, and about 500 botles of beer :D

pfren
IM pfren
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Aug 28, 2015
0
#74

I prefer good wines, but they are expensive...

Eseles
Eseles
Aug 28, 2015
0
#75
Pulpofeira wrote:

Beer is everywhere. But yes, at least my wife uses exclusively olive oil for cooking...

she can cook with beer and wine, too! ;D

TheOldReb
NM TheOldReb
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Aug 28, 2015
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#76

When I was in Germany I discovered first hand the German's love for beer , at least among chess players ! There was a cafe in town where chess players would gather and we would play blitz for hours , everyone would be drinking beer and the loser had to buy the beer for himself and his opponent . Soon , we all would be drunk and noone really cared who was paying for the beer !  Cool

Eseles
Eseles
Aug 28, 2015
0
#77
pfren wrote:

I prefer good wines, but they are expensive...

yeah, cost is a very important factor, especially in these days we're going through...

...how about some ouzo? :D

pfren
IM pfren
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Aug 28, 2015
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#78

Ouzo is good to get totally drunk within twenty minutes, and hardly something more than that.

Eseles
Eseles
Aug 28, 2015
0
#79
pfren wrote:

Ouzo is good to get totally drunk within twenty minutes, and hardly something more than that.

well, if it's your opponent who's getting drunk, it can work in your favor

BD

Salvator_Mundi
Salvator_Mundi
Aug 28, 2015
0
#80

I'd recommend a bottle of chateuneuf du pape to anyone who enjoys complex reds.