Q&A and Personal Game Analysis

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Avatar of LogoCzar

Here I will do my best to answer any questions on the schliemann gambit. Also Diogenes_of_Sinope because he seems to know a lot about the opening as well. Anyone is welcome to answer what they think the answer is.

Here is where we will discuss and learn together about the opening, other than the forums on specific varyations. Here it is more generalised.

Also if you play a game where you play the Schliemann (I recomend you do) please post it here and we will discuss, and analyze it together. :) - logozar 



Avatar of LogoCzar
kkarla wrote:

Normally white wins correct?

According to the game explorer, that is correct, though whites win rate is not higher than most Roy Lopez lines.

This also contributes to the fact that about 1/6 of the games were played by black with an unsound line from the romantic era (where gambits were common).

Nowdays, because of this, whites win rate is inflated.

With proper play, black at least equalises, and this is assuming white knows what he is doing.

This line is so unknown at club player level that I have played hundreds of games in the roy lopez and never faced it! Also there has never (Until now) been a serious group to analyse it.

So technically yes, but we don't have to play the flawed lines that were experimented with.

Black is equal/better in almost every good line with proper play, and I am posting all the lines I know in the forums, and they are being analysed, and added to.

 

The stats of the game explorer are here

3...f5 3,076
44.5% 27.7%

27.9%

Avatar of Bishop_g5

 Hello Schliemann group, i finished today a game i played as black using the Jaenisch and i will try to share with you my thoughts,concerns during or after the game. The truth is that i dont have much experience using the opening and this is the reason why i joined the group, so thank you Logozar giving us this chance to learn more about it.

 My game was played in the 4.d3 line only that my opponent instead of the theoretically 7.Qd3 he played the popular 7.0-0. I followed the instructions to get rid the c3 knight and i equalize the position rather quicly until i realize that i couldn't escape from draw. I would be very happy to bother someone explain what i miss, or maybe an improvement to play for something more.



Avatar of LogoCzar
Bishop_g5 wrote:

 Hello Schliemann group, i finished today a game i played as black using the Jaenisch and i will try to share with you my thoughts,concerns during or after the game. The truth is that i dont have much experience using the opening and this is the reason why i joined the group, so thank you Logozar giving us this chance to learn more about it.

 My game was played in the 4.d3 line only that my opponent instead of the theoretically 7.Qd3 he played the popular 7.0-0. I followed the instructions to get rid the c3 knight and i equalize the position rather quicly until i realize that i couldn't escape from draw. I would be very happy to bother someone explain what i miss, or maybe an improvement to play for something more.

Hope I can help with this.

I am not a pro, so I might be able to help with the opening stage but not sure about later technique (you seem a little stronger than me there)

Remember, this is a drawing resource (black equalises quickly) but you can not FORCE an advantage with this opening. You get an advantage if you outplay your opponent after equalising (like any opening) or if the opponent does not know the opening well.

 
Personally, I think you played great! But you chose more drawish lines at a critical moment, and so less play occured and it ended up drawn.
Perhaps if you want to play for a win play Bd7 after Qe7 and castle queenside? It is not better or worce, but allows a bit more play for both sides, and winning chances.
 
I think you played great! Lichess says both of you made no innacuracys blunders or mistakes and played at exactally 5 centipawn loss each (Which is phenominal, GM's don't usually do as good), but that happens often when the position dosn't have attacking chances and you play careful.
 
Hope this helps! - logozar



Avatar of LogoCzar

Does anyone else have any imput?

Avatar of Bishop_g5

Thank you Logozar for your analysis. As I said , I am not familiar with the opening and I couldn't find so far any book to read some theory about . Our group forum is very rich in informations and I will definitely use the opening again. You may right about the attacking chances with Bd7 and 0-0-0 but I had in mind to use this line first and I was afraid off this open b file.

I believe the computer evaluation from lichess is not accurate. I don't feel that my moves was the best ones but as you described in critical moments I was chicken out! From a technical point of view I feel that the position after 15.cxb3 can be played from black much better but I can't prove it. Lack of knowledge and experience. Anyway thank you again and hope next time I post to have more to show and more attacking spirit.

Avatar of LogoCzar

I recently played a game with a sideline I am not an expert in. Can someone offer thier opinion on the game? It was 40 min per side, and I was black.



Avatar of LogoCzar
Avatar of ijgeoffrey

Here's my first naturally occurring Schliemann. Granted, my opponent made a couple blunders, but I'd still appreciate feedback.

Avatar of LogoCzar
ijgeoffrey wrote: Here's my first naturally occurring Schliemann. Granted, my opponent made a couple blunders, but I'd still appreciate feedback. 

Alright, here is what I think on the game.

 
Good game!
Anyone else have anything to input?



Avatar of ijgeoffrey

 Thank you logozar! Just one note though: I moved 7... e4 because, having looked at your analyses on the "How to deal with 4. Nc3" thread, I read post #5's analyses for 7. 0-0. It was captioned with, "how to basically force a draw." I didn't want to force a draw, so I looked at the other options noted, and chose one. I did not see 7... Bc5 in that analysis. Perhaps you might want to add that to the analysis?

Avatar of Bishop_g5

 Hi , Schliemann players! I finished my first game in our second team match challenge and i am ready to take a look inside. My opponent blundered quickly in the middle game and resigned but i find interesting the prospect for black to play for a win in this line.



Avatar of LogoCzar
ijgeoffrey wrote:

 Thank you logozar! Just one note though: I moved 7... e4 because, having looked at your analyses on the "How to deal with 4. Nc3" thread, I read post #5's analyses for 7. 0-0. It was captioned with, "how to basically force a draw." I didn't want to force a draw, so I looked at the other options noted, and chose one. I did not see 7... Bc5 in that analysis. Perhaps you might want to add that to the analysis?

Thank you, perhaps I will add later.

Avatar of LogoCzar

Great game Bishop!

I personally like 16... Rf7 better

as well as d6>Qg6 (You mentioned this)

Perhaps we can find the best way for black to play for a win? If you have any ideas post in any forum

Avatar of Alexandr-Kravchenko

I went to our local chess club and I played the Schliemann/Jaenisch defence to suprise my higer rated opponent. It works, it became a draw.



Avatar of LogoCzar

No need to go down a pawn in that line:



Avatar of LogoCzar

Nicely played otherwise

Avatar of LogoCzar

In actuality I believe fxe4 was slightly better than Bc5, just my opinion here