The ostrich

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Avatar of amrugg

Will you admit that the ostrich lives in Africa, where there's lions?

Will you admit that the ostrich might be on the menu for a tasty snack?

Will you admit that the ostrich has a powerful kick that can kill a lion, and that's it's defense?

Will you admit that if the ostrich needed time to develop this defensive ability, the first one would get eaten, and they would not be able to reproduce(cause they're dead)?

Avatar of TheJamesOfAllJameses

That's... Not... exactly how they claim evolution works. 

Avatar of stephen_33

I don't know much about the specific evolution of the ostrich but such creatures aren't dropped down from space. It would have evolved from an earlier species that would also have had to escape big-cat predators, or their antecedents.

So the ability to evade predators by kicking would have developed over a long period of time, probably inherited from an earlier species. Natural Selection causes those individuals that are better equipped to escape from predators to survive & breed in greater numbers than those that get caught.

But the scenario presented, in which an ostrich has to develop the ability to evade capture practically overnight, isn't realistic.

Avatar of amrugg

What bird would need to kick? Most would say, "Tweet, tweet, you can't catch me!"

Avatar of TheJamesOfAllJameses

Ehh, not exactly. 

Avatar of TheJamesOfAllJameses

More like, God designed the ostrich for some reason, and He gave it the ability to kick, since it is flightless, He gave it the ability to kick for defence. 

Avatar of amrugg

Yes, that is what really happened(and I'm trying to tell him that). But a sparrow would look at a lion curiously, and if it tried to eat it, it would fly away. 

Avatar of stephen_33

Remember that the ostrich can't fly! It doesn't have that option of defending itself. It must either outrun a predator or find some other form of defense.

There isn't anything about the way the ostrich defends itself that can't be explained in evolutionary terms.

Avatar of TheJamesOfAllJameses

Or true creation terms.

God created the ostrich to fill some position in the food chain, and because of it's place in the food chain, He gave it features to help it survive.

Avatar of TheJamesOfAllJameses

An ostrich is not a sparrow. That isn't what the Evolutionists believe, you see.

Avatar of stephen_33

Perhaps we have the force of gravity all wrong as well? After all, by the same reasoning you apply to evolution, is it so far fetched that it's not gravity but the hand of some unseen deity that pulls to earth  every object that falls?

Avatar of TheJamesOfAllJameses

Ehh, God made gravity. 

Avatar of TheJamesOfAllJameses

God made the earth like a terrarium, he put everything needed for a healthy ecosystem, and then he left it alone.

Avatar of TheJamesOfAllJameses

With the ecosystem of the earth. Not spiritually.

Avatar of TheJamesOfAllJameses

God made the plants to photosynthesize themselves, without any help.  

Avatar of stephen_33

Beyond mere wishful thinking, on what source of authority are (some of) you basing your belief that any magical being did anything?

Avatar of stephen_33
JayHunterBrickwood wrote:

Ehh, God made gravity. 

I was alluding to evolution being a self-regulating system that drives the diversification of living forms without the need for any outside influence to keep 'tinkering with the machine', rather like gravity.

But you then go on to state that anyway, more or less?

Avatar of stephen_33
sciencechimp2004 wrote:
stephen_33 wrote:

Beyond mere wishful thinking, on what source of authority are (some of) you basing your belief that any magical being did anything?

The Bible. And God is not just a "magical being." He's the Lord of the universe.

But do you really think that the Bible gives you reliable information on such issues? When I read the Book of Genesis, I see one inconsistency after another. I even started a topic on it in Mindwalk's alternative open-discussion group:-

https://www.chess.com/clubs/forum/view/genesis-tribal-mythology-or-the-word-of-god?page=1

You're most welcome to come & give your opinion...

Avatar of TheJamesOfAllJameses
sciencechimp2004 wrote:
JayHunterBrickwood wrote:

God made the plants to photosynthesize themselves, without any help.  

So if a plant suddenly stops performing photosynthesis and ultimately dies, God just watches it happen and has no control over it?

God created plants to photosynthesize without any help, so it wouldn't suddenly stop photosyntesizing.

Avatar of varelse1
amrugg wrote:

Will you admit that the ostrich lives in Africa, where there's lions?

Will you admit that the ostrich might be on the menu for a tasty snack?

Will you admit that the ostrich has a powerful kick that can kill a lion, and that's it's defense?

Will you admit that if the ostrich needed time to develop this defensive ability, the first one would get eaten, and they would not be able to reproduce(cause they're dead)?

I will admit that as the ostrich got stronger over time, then the lions needed to get stronger over time as well, to compete.

Is called the "Keeping up with the Jonses" effect.

Does that suffice?