Serious Problem with V-Tek 300 clock.

I received a message from a guy in the Northwest about a few problems he has found with his V-Tek 300 clock.  One of the problems does not exist in either of my clocks as his is a beta version, so doesn't apply.

Another problem does exist and is quite serious for using increment.  While using increment, when one player's time ends, we see a "Time Expired" notice at the bottom of that player's display.  The problem is that if that player presses his button, even after his time has expired, the clock adds the increment time to his clock.  So, if the opponent or FIDE Arbiter does not notice that the time has expired and the player hits his clock, he now has time on his clock and the time expiration no longer is there.

The third problem he mentioned is not a big problem.  If you turn off the tenth of a second display and there is less than a second left, the clock will still show all zeros but run until that second is completely gone.

Anyway, the second problem really makes the clock not good for use in increment time controls.  I was actually going to use mine this coming Monday evening for a club tournament involving increment.  Now I must go to my trusty Chronos.

Shelby Lohrman has been made aware of these problems.  The problem is that the guy who manufactures the clock needs to be contacted, most likely by Shelby.  Then they will need to arrange for all clocks to be returned to Texas to be fixed.  Until then the clock should really only be used for delay time controls.

three letter reply: DGT.

Actually the Chronos clocks are another and versatile option.

I also do have a DGT 3000 coming.  The display is larger and better than their other models and the clock can be bought on eBay for about $81 shipped from Koganov.  The only problem is that it is made of cheap plastic.

But getting the V-Tek clocks fixed will also make things better.

No, that does not fix the problem.

In US Chess the opponent's clock still needs to run so if both players are out of time it is a draw.

The Freeze stops both clocks.

Yup!

If the opponent does not notice the player's time has run out, and then his time runs out, both players will show both of their times are expired.

This can actually be an easy thing to happen if both players only have seconds on their clocks to begin with.

This is a US Chess rule.  FIDE wants the clocks to freeze, so in the FIDE mode they both will freeze.

As I said earlier, Shelby Lohrman is aware from the first guy's comments that I forwarded to Shelby.  I haven't spoken with Shelby since I found the problem with my, production clock.

Shelby has to talk with the guy who owns the manufacturing place to find out exactly what they will do.

Any word on this issue? I was about to buy one of these clocks when I found this thread... I use increment time controls routinely and this sounds like a deal-breaker.

I talked with Shelby on Thursday.  Friday he was driving to a tournament for 6 hours and said he would be calling the manufacturer then.  He is running the books and equipment sales at that tournament so he won't be back home until early in the week.

I like Shelby and buy a lot of equipment from him.  I just received some of those new, green boards he just came out with, for instance.  I also got a beta version of the V-Tek and ended up buying a production model from him as well.

The problem is the manufacturer in Texas.  This guy is not a Chess player and has had nothing to do with Chess until he hooked up with Shelby over this clock.  Shelby is not even selling the V-Tek on his site since he merged with another company in the summer.

I'm not holding my breath for the fix to come very soon.

What I would suggest is one of the following:

1. If you want the stability of the aluminum body, the Chronos II is the clock to buy.  The buttons are identical between the two brands and the display types look identical except the V-Tek model is a bit taller to accommodate a second yet smaller line of display.  I own and used this clock last week for my increment, rated game.  You do need to add the 30 seconds to the start time when setting it to make it the same as the FIDE regulations and all other increment clocks, like the DGT's.

2. The Chronos GX is a smaller but still metal body clock that also provides increment.  The size is comparable to the ZMF clocks and DGT clocks.  This clock runs about $10 less than the Chronos II.

3. The DGT 3000 has all the timing options for either US Chess or FIDE.  I actually traded (down) one of my V-Tek clocks for one of these.  I also bought one of these for another at $81 shipped and complete from eBay.  This clock does have a plastic body but its timing is really good and I want one that is easy to set for increment (the Chronos clocks are a bit difficult in this) and be reliable.

The above suggestions are not in the order of my priority suggestions.  My first suggested clock would be the Chronos II because of its great display and stability.

My second suggestion would be the DGT 3000.

The third choice would be the Chronos GX.

If you do decide to buy a V-Tek just realize you will need to send it in to the manufacturer to have the programming updated.

Eyechess:  Are Shelby's green boards similar to the Butterman boards?  How do like the black outlines for the squares?  Are they distracting?

Eyechess - appreciate the quick reply. I actually own the three clocks you mention as alternatives.

The Chronos II is my all-time favorite clock (for both chess and go); my only gripe is the display inconsistencies between modes (not a big deal, really). I wish they were more readily available as I only have the one with the touch sensors, and I'd like to have one with buttons as well.

The GX is a great follow-on to the big Chronos, and I love the simplicity of the settings, but I don't like the 4-digit displays for longer time controls - I only use it for blitz and quick time controls because of this.

The DGT 3000 is probably the most full-featured pure chess clock around, but I find that the display is far too busy, I don't like the H:MM.SS format, it feels "cheap," and I don't like the actuation mechanism - too "clunky." It mostly sits on the shelf waiting for the big Chronos to break (God forbid).

The V-Tek clock appealed to me a sort of an "ultimate compromise" for my desires, but I think I'll wait and see for now. 

Strangely the VTEK300 does not freeze in the FIDE mode.

I sent my V-Tek in for a program repair and update.  I received it back.

1. The problems noted above have indeed been corrected.  The Time Expired sign now means just that and that clock will stop while the other will continue to run, in the US Chess style.

2. I ended up giving my Beta clock away and only have the one clock now so I don't have the original programming to compare.  However, I think they changed the options or Preferences so that now you can turn the Freeze and Sound on or off separately no matter what Play mode (FIDE or US Chess) is active.

3. They also now have it where you can handicap the times at the beginning of the game.  You can give the players different time controls.  And when that game is done, you can quickly go back to that time setup for a new game.

4. They also added a shortcut way to turn on the clock with the last time control used displayed and ready to start after just one click.  This is actually quite a nice option in use of the clock.

5. When in US Chess Play Mode and using Increment the starting time does not show with the increment time added as it is with the DGT clocks and the way FIDE wants it.  However in the FIDE Play Mode and using increment, the increment time is added to the displayed time at the start.  The DGT only has the option with the time added.

So, all in all this clock has now become what was promised and expected.  It's display and operation "feel" is as good as the Chronos II (with buttons).  It also has the same aluminum body with the looks and feel of the Chronos.

The V-Tek is a lot easier to set than the Chronos and it now has all the options we want in a Chess clock.

The drawbacks, to me, are the large size and bulk of the clock and the too high price.

If I were going to buy a new clock and did not own any Chronos or V-Tek or DGT 3000 clock, I would have the think long and hard on which would be my choice.

As of now I would most likely get a Chronos II for quite a bit less money than the V-Tek.  I also would be able to buy 2 DGT-3000 clocks, on eBay, for just a few more dollars than one V-Tek.

I contacted them and got a RMA form.  I then paid to ship it to them, about $12.  They then charged me (I gave them my credit card number) $12 to pay for the shipping back.  They did not charge anything for the program repair/update.

Under 'Preferences' then 'About' you will cycle to the 'Version' you will see it as 1 . 0 . 2 to be the updated version.

They have been updating for about 2 or 3 weeks at the most.

Not to get into technicalities, but that is definitely the rule, but I don't know that there is a rule that explicitly states that a clock must not have a freeze setting on it.  I know that if an opponent has flagged and the other has not noticed, then the game continues, but the freeze will ultimately ensure that the opponent will eventually notice.

I'm sure most TDs tend to interpolate a rule that disallows freezing in the USCF, but I don't know that it's actually in the rule book.  Then again, I'm not sure what to do as a TD, should I notice that there's a freeze on a clock, even after I notice it, because it would alert the opponent to the flag!  Seems like a difficult situation.

Okay, so this is really just a problem for USCF tournaments with an increment.  Dual rated events that are FIDE and USCF always have FIDE rules superseding any USCF rules that conflict.  If I use my clock at the National Open in the U2300, which is FIDE rated, then I have nothing to worry about, in using my VTEK300, right?

Ron,  the shortcut way to turn on the clock with the last time control used ready to start after just one click works on my beta test version of the VTEK300 so I don't think this was a new features added from the latest update. Also, how did they add the ability to handicap times at the beginning of the game? The only way I can see how you can set the clock for time odds at the beginning of the game is to use the TD adjust feature but that works with the Beta test version of the clock. Also, the updated version of the clock that doesn't have this problem is 1.0.3.