Classical Ruy Lopez fork trick- Refuted?

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Avatar of zezpwn44

Avatar of BigTy

Lol white is much better if not winning. Seriously, 2 bishops, and absolute dominance in the centre, what more could you ask for from an opening!

Avatar of zezpwn44

Hmm, really?  White doesn't have too much more "dominance" in the center than he gets in some openings, and his King can't castle and will find it hard to do so artifically.  He does have the bishop pair in an open position, but woulnd't his King quickly become vulnerable? 

Avatar of xiii-Dex
zezpwn44 wrote:

Hmm, really?  White doesn't have too much more "dominance" in the center than he gets in some openings, and his King can't castle and will find it hard to do so artifically.  He does have the bishop pair in an open position, but woulnd't his King quickly become vulnerable? 


I think realitymate has proven how fast white can castle artificially using the tempo gained from d4

Avatar of xiii-Dex

I will gladly play a thematic unrated game if you want!

Avatar of Shakaali

The position after 3... Bc5 is well known theory and white doesn't usually play 4. Nxe5 but I've never really thought about why this is. Perhaps 4... Qg5!? causes white problems.

Avatar of TheOldReb

After 6 d4 black's best ( imo ) is either 6... Nc6 right away or first 6... Qf6+ 7 Kg1 Nc6 and white may still be slightly better but I dont think white is winning

Avatar of Dragec

I believe that the name of the thread is a bit misleading.

Classical Ruy Lopez fork trick IMO would be:

I would name the thread - " refuted fork trick in Ruy Lopez, classical defence".

And moreover, I don't think that "fork trick" deserves much attention here, as it only a distant 6th choice after black play Bc5 - chessgames.com opening explorer:

4. O-O  355

38.6%

36.1%

25.4%
4. c3  345

45.5%

29.3%

25.2%
4. Nc3  23

39.1%

17.4

43.5%
4. d3  11

54.5%

18.2%

27.3%
4. Bxc6  8

37.5%

25%

37.5%
4. Nxe5  3

33.3%

33.3%

33.3%
Avatar of Atos

6. ... Qf6 + seems like the Black's best chance to pose the White some short-term problems in this line (at least to not help them out with artificially castling), but the White has the long-term advantages of two central pawns and the Bishop's pair. Apparently the Black's best replies to the "fork trick" 4. Nxe5 are 4. ...Qe7 or 4. ...Qg5, where the Black is supposedly almost equal. The "fork trick" is of course known to theory but it isn't the main line for the White.

Avatar of Dragec

The fork trick I get the chance to use often is in Two knights defence:

Avatar of DrSpudnik

Oh yes, the Italian 4 Knights (which I call the Idiot's 4 Knights) which always gets the Knight trick. Even the lame 4 Bxf7+ Kxf7 5. Nxe4 fails to d5 where Black takes over the center.